Wednesday, June 27, 2012

A breakthrough or a blip?

US Presswire photo
Michael Morse collected four of the Nationals' 21 hits last night.
As the hits kept piling up and the balls kept soaring out of Coors Field, the smiles inside the Nationals' dugout kept getting bigger and bigger.

If ever a team needed a 12-run, 21-hit performance, this was it. For the first time in a long time, the Nationals were able to rest easy knowing they had a comfortable lead in hand. Not since a 7-2 victory in Atlanta on May 27 had they won a game by more than four runs.

And they hadn't hit like this since ... well, they hadn't hit like this any previous game this season. You have to go back to May 20, 2011 to find the last time the Nationals scored at least 12 runs (they racked up 17 that night in Baltimore). And you have to go way back to July 11, 2009 in Houston to find the last time they compiled 21 hits (the club record since the franchise arrived in Washington). And you can go back as far as you want but you won't find any previous game in which the Nationals pounded out 11 extra-base hits as they did last night.

Yes, in one fell swoop, this team managed to take the heat off its hitting coach, raise its season batting average four points (from .238 to .242) and slugging percentage eight points (from .387 to .395) and perhaps convince everyone in their clubhouse to request cortisone shots by daybreak.

Try picking one player of the game. You can't. Ryan Zimmerman went 3-for-5, making him 6-for-12 with two doubles and a homer since getting one of those pain-killing shots on his shoulder on Sunday. Michael Morse and Ian Desmond each went 4-for-5, each driving in a pair. Adam LaRoche smacked two homers, raising his team-leading total to 15. And Tyler Moore hit a 440-foot bomb way up into the left-field bleachers, driving in three runs himself with one mighty swing.

This was as cathartic a ballgame as ever there was, for any number of people in Nationals uniforms who desperately needed something like this.

But what was the significance of this in the bigger picture? Was this the breakthrough game that will catapult all these slumping hitters to greater heights and turn their fortunes around? Or was this merely a blip on the radar, a one-time explosion inside the greatest hitters park ever constructed and a precursor to more struggles moving forward?

We don't yet know, but we do know a few things...

1. Zimmerman looks like a brand-new hitter now that he's not feeling any pain in his right shoulder. He looks like the guy who carried this franchise for much of the last six seasons.

2. Morse was too good of a hitter to continue like this for long. With four hits, he raised his batting average an astounding 31 points in one night, from .219 to .250. He certainly appears ready to kick his delayed season into high gear now.

3. Moore looks like the real deal at the plate, a legitimate masher who can produce against left-handers and right-handers alike. The rookie is now hitting .319 with three homers and eight RBI in only 53 plate appearances

4. In a sport in which success is predicated so much on the confidence level of the players involved, there will be no more confident group this morning than the members of the Nationals lineup.

Could all of this become moot in 24 hours? Sure, the Nats could fall back into their offensively challenged ways and never come close to duplicating these feats at the plate.

Just don't tell that to anyone inside that clubhouse, which will be overflowing with confidence and good vibes when both teams take the field for tonight's game.

The only numbers that matter to them today are 12 and 21. They're the numbers that defined the most-productive offensive day this franchise has experienced in a long time.

And right now, there isn't one guy in uniform who doesn't believe they can do this again.

215 comments:

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MicheleS said...

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO HOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!! (sorry this is a little late!)

Fingers are crossed that it is a breakthrough! Glad to see Beast is starting the rake. And at least we had the power stroke last night!

terpman33 said...

Man, it's about time. Not only did the players need a game like this, but WE as Nats fan needed a game like this. The middle of the lineup really came through tonight. Maybe Ryan Z. can get through the season with cortisone shots. Believe me, I'm not asking for 10 or 12 runs every game, but 4 or 5 would do wonders for the season. We'll see what happens the rest of the series, but at least we can enjoy this one. GYFNG!!!

NatsJack in Florida said...

And yet another day with that 3 1/2 game lead.

ehay2k said...

Is this a case of the media's laser pointed at Eckstein lighting a fire under the players?

No matter, let's hope the hitting continues. I thought Zimmerman looked very good, very comfortable.

alexva said...

last night proves little about Eckstein but it does show that you hit as part of a lineup. if one guy slumps it's harder on the next. since we had more than three guys slumping, disaster.

second, on Ghost's comment in game thread, if Wang does not pitch in that game when does he. I'm okay with not today, just saying.

lastly JZimm saw more runs than what he gets in a month, can we please just give him half of that tonight

m20832 said...

Ok....where did the real Nats go and why were the Yankees wearing Nationals uniforms? :-)

GYFNG!!!!

It does a fan good to see a game like this. Even if it is against the Rockies.
C'mon JZim, let's get you some run support today!

SCNatsFan said...

ehay2K, I believe if players step it up for a coach or manager on the hot seat then I believe the coach should be fired, he didn't have them playing as hard as they could from the start.

All should be well in the Nats world and this forum today.... shouldn't it???

MicheleS said...

m20832.. congrats on your pick last night - Beast!!!

So good to see the boys hit! I heard a funny tale on MLB Radio about the game last night. After TyMo hit that BOMB, ALR goes up to him and says "Are you trying to show me up?" and then goes out and hits another bomb. Haven't flipped over to the other Beats yet, but I hope that is a true story.

Positively Half St. said...

All is well, in fact. I was especially encouraged to read this morning that the Nats have had one of the toughest schedules in the league up to this point. Granted, part of that is being in the NL East, but it still is encouraging to think that they may have an overall easier schedule the rest of the year.

+1/2St.

Steady Eddie said...

While one can caveat this all one wants (terrible pitchers, Coors Field), we haven't been able to get the league average against lousy pitchers almost all season, the "Cy Whomever" syndrome we all know about.

Well, the next five games are all against pitchers who are bad to worse this year -- after Rocks we get Delgado, Minor, and Hanson (ERA7.35) in Atlanta, where we mashed in May. Here's our road to get well, unimpeded by anyone who looks anything like an ace.

Tim said...

I'll drink the Kool-Aid if we do this in Atlanta (or some semblance of it). It's a nice win in COORS FIELD.

MicheleS said...

JaneB.. well we know why your daughter didn't get to go to the Gala now..

Gio's Date

I Love GIO!!!

NatsJack in Florida said...

I've said it before and I'll say it again. What the Nats or anybody else did yesterday, last week or last month have absolutely no bearing on what may or may not happen today, tomorrow, next week or next month. Such is the nature of baseball.

NatsJack in Florida said...

See Miami Marlins - May version versus June version.

Tim said...

NatsJack, I'm not sure the Fish are a good example... too much dysfunction on that team... errr... group of players.

Steady Eddie said...

NatsJack -- the only caveat on your "no bearing" is the lesson from your example. Baseball can be very streaky. With five more games against the Rocks before the ASB, time for a hitting streak to get us there on a high note.

We'll need it against Lincecum (I know he's lousy this year and we have gotten to him at home), Bumgartner and Cain against JZimm EJax and Det. Maybe the Giants will wilt in the unaccustomed DC humidity.

Gonat said...

NatsJack in Florida said...
I've said it before and I'll say it again. What the Nats or anybody else did yesterday, last week or last month have absolutely no bearing on what may or may not happen today, tomorrow, next week or next month. Such is the nature of baseball.

June 27, 2012 7:41 AM
_______________________________

Yes, that is true unless the "fix" is on. Also, one game is still too early to tell if a streak is about to begin. Teams slump, teams streak. Let's hope this is the beginning of a streak.

m20832 said...

Thanks MicheleS! I had a feeling it was going to happen! Can only keep the Beastie down for so long! Had to let him Loose!

Runs for JZim! Runs for JZim! Runs for JZim!

Faraz Shaikh said...

HR/FB% for JZ is 13.6% and jackson is 8.7% but 38.6% FB%. we are facing a AA pitcher making his big league debut in Coors Field.

natsfan1a said...

Holey moley, was that ever a happy game results email! Funny thing, I checked in on the game score before retiring: Nats 4, Rockies 3. Woke up this morning to Nats 12, Rockies 5. Wow. When I told my husband, he said that the Rockies bullpen must have blown up. My own initial reaction was that the Nats bats must have awakened. Two quite different reactions, which we had a laugh about (he may need a bit more of that refreshing red beverage). :-)

Faraz Shaikh said...

the last time Nats scored that many against rockies in coors field, they followed it up with 3 straight losses against them. this is a different ballclub so hoping for much different results. go nats!

natsfan1a said...

Oh, and congrats to Mr. 1000.

Mr. Doggett said...

There was more than just Cortisone in that shot. Reports are that the trainers actually added Felix Felicis to the injection as well.

Laddie Blah Blah said...

As long as Zim can swing the bat as well as he is now, the Nats will win the NL East. But that shoulder could act up, again. For now, he is as relaxed and swinging the bat as easily as any Nats fan and Zim supporter could hope for.

The guy who is really getting my attention, though, is TyMo. He is not that tall and not long, at all. His height and short arms are a handicap in LF, where he will have trouble going back on balls hit over his head, as he showed last night.

But his short arms give him a naturally compact swing. The guy keeps his shoulders square in the box, minimizes the lower part of his body when he steps into his swing, and then generates enormous power with a sudden rotation of his shoulders and hips into the ball. Almost the mirror opposite of Harp's approach. That is how golfers generate power, by torquing their upper bodies and bringing the large muscles of the upper back and shoulders into play.

By keeping his lower body relatively quiet, he keeps his head still. He has fewer moving parts in that swing, and so there are fewer things that can go wrong. Everyone has slumps, but TyMo has the kind of simple, compact swing which could minimize them.

A long, long time ago, I swung best when I used the same approach. It is amazing how far you can hit a ball with a swing like that. He reminds me a little of Harmon Killebrew, also not a tall guy who also had short arms. You can't tell because of the looseness of the BB uni, but my guess is TyMo has got some really strong lats, traps and delts.

He gives Rizzo an enviable dilemma. TyMo has got to be an everyday guy, unless he gets hurt. So the Nats have TyMo, the Beast, and ALR, and only 2 positions available. Davey can play Morse in RF until Werth comes back, so he can keep the Beast, ALR, and TyMo in the lineup until then.

But when Werth comes back, who sits? Suddenly, the Nats have an embarrassment of riches in the OF, with Corey Brown hitting more dingers and XBH in AAA than Harp and TyMo did, combined.

FWIW, I think Gonat is right, and Harp's back is hurting his swing. He won't reach outside the zone to go to LF any more, as he did so effectively when he first came up. He did not suddenly get stupid, any more than Zim suddenly lost any of his talent. Injuries to elite athletes can turn them into ordinary journeymen, just as easily as that.

I now hope Harp does not make the AST. He needs to rest that back and return from the break swinging like the Cyborg we came to know so well.

Let's get at least 4 runs for JZ tonight.

The Real Feel Wood. Accept no substitutes. said...

I would actually prefer that they NOT win games like this, because based on recent history this team does not respond well afterward.

5/20/11 beat Orioles 17-5, lose 5 in a row
9/6/10 beat Mets 13-3, lose 6 in a row
5/31/10 beat Astros 14-4, lose 5 of next 6
5/13/10 beat Rockies 14-6, lose 5 in a row
8/25/09 beat Cubs 15-6, lose 9 of next 10
7/11/09 beat Astros 13-2, lose 6 in a row
6/27/09 beat Brewers 14-6, lose 4 of next 5

The lone outlier is 8/28/10 when they beat the Cardinals 14-5 and responded with a modest 3 straight wins.

Lets see if this year's team can reverse this pattern before we start jumping for joy.

sjm308 said...

Only fitting after repeling so many comments yesterday that Michelle gets to lead off with her
WOOOOHOOOO!! It was done last night in your honor, not by me but by another very strong poster.

Don't want to get too excited, NatsJack is correct about baseball being day to day (what do they say, its only as good as your next starting pitcher?) but Steady is right as well and things can get streaky and hopefully the good hitting rubs off on each other. I will be surprised if Tyler Moore sits now. I am also hoping that Davey starts to rest Zimm, Desmond, Espinosa and LaRoche for one start each week. You have Moore who can play first (or Morse), Lombo can spell Danny and Zimm and Espi can move over to short for a game. I think sometimes these guys play too many games without rest and it can wear you down. I also think its time for Bryce to sit, again just for a game to rest mentally and physically. Not only that, it then strengthens your bench if the game is tight in late innings.

OK Rockies, you have seen Strasburg and Gio, get ready for Jordan!

Go Nats!!

Drew said...

The only Nat who had a bad night is Chris Marrero, who's looking up at LaRoche, Morse and Moore.

Marrero has done pretty well on his rehab assignment, hitting .304 with 2 homers and 12 RBIs in 19 games at different levels.

But with those guys in front of him it's hard to see him getting called up before rosters expand in September.

sm13 said...

Let's hope this isn't a "blip" , but rather the start of an offensive surge. If Zim, Morse, La Roche , et al get some confidence and swagger from this game they can go on a tear and set us up for a great second half of the season. Our pitchers could use a breather from high stress games.

NatsJack in Florida said...

Laddie..... TyMo = Josh Willingham with a higher upside.

NatsJack in Florida said...

Drew.... Marrero is no longer on rehab assignment. He has been assigned to the Syracuse roster.

Faraz Shaikh said...

JZ's era in Coors Field is 3.72 and Jackson's is 15.75.

sjm308 said...

Faraz, being reasonable right now before I hit the gym is still not going to get me worried but those are telling stats on Jackson. I am sure the park is in his head. Maybe he can get a cortisone shot there.

Go Nats!!

MicheleS said...

I think Mark posted something in an earlier thread about RZ getting hot around July 4th.. Let's hope this is him getting warm before he really takes off.

Oh and as for not getting overly excited about this win.. Puleeeze! I am going to be doing a Happy Dance and Drinking Koolaid until 8:30 Tonight. I just want to savor ONE victory. Especially since we had the doom sayers calling for the head of every player, coach, manager and the GM for the last week.

sjm308 said...

Posted this late last night but check out the disappointed attendance for the O's with the powerhouse Angels in town (24,000 announced & you know that means less). We sell the place out and Pujols can't draw squat. Just says the Nationals have arrived, or that we traveled well.

Go Nats!

sjm308 said...

Michelle, get ready to fight them off again. It's a long season!!

Mr. Doggett said...

According to team sources, there was more than just Cortisone in the shot that Zimmerman received. Reports are that a small dose of Felix Felicis was also present in the injection.

alexva said...

thanks for the research FeelWood but I knew those teams from 2009 and 2010, this is not those teams.

natsfan1a said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
natsfan1a said...

I'm with you, MicheleS (cranks up volume on music). Would you care for another glass of that refreshing red beverage? I'm serving this morning. :-)

MicheleS said...

I think Mark posted something in an earlier thread about RZ getting hot around July 4th.. Let's hope this is him getting warm before he really takes off.

Oh and as for not getting overly excited about this win.. Puleeeze! I am going to be doing a Happy Dance and Drinking Koolaid until 8:30 Tonight. I just want to savor ONE victory. Especially since we had the doom sayers calling for the head of every player, coach, manager and the GM for the last week.
June 27, 2012 8:46 AM

MicheleS said...

Mr Doggett.. The Felix Felices was only a drop.. They are saving the rest of it for September and October ;-)

And Yes 1A, I will have another glass!!!

NatsJack in Florida said...

C'mon people... no mixing Harry Potter with baseball..... cricket maybe but definitely not baseball.

A DC Wonk said...

Agree with other comments re: one game doesn't mean much to the next. What _is_ clear is that RZ is swinging the bat better and quicker since the injection.

Good thing Davey didn't listen to our negative armchair GM's in yesterday's thread, eh? (Like, the ones that suggested we promote the entire AAA team to replace RZ, Morse, LaRoche, etc.)

(Speaking of which, the absence of those certain negative folks following a win is another benefit of the Nats winning ;-) )

Doc said...

Coors Stadium must be a good place to hit a knuckleball.

Our breaking pitches were just slightly more effective than their breaking pitches.

GoooBig Hitters; GooooooooooooooooooNats!!

natscan reduxit said...

Dear Mr. Blah Blah,

Jayson Werth? Who's that?

Go Nats, at any level!!

MicheleS said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
MicheleS said...

Peric said...
Hmmm, strongly suggest that Natsfan1a, NatsNut, and MicheleS and too many others avoid sitting behind the visitors dugout. Because a certain newer fan but famous DC sports fan named Robin Ficker might be there ...

I wouldn't mind sitting next to him at all at all ... but some of you folks? ~smiles~ Ha!


Guess what, Ficker heckles the Opposing team, so I would probably enjoy him thoroughly!

Theophilus T. S. said...

I don't know how much hope you can take from beating up on what may turn out to be a historically bad pitching staff. (1930 Phillies?) I'm waiting to see if they can beat the next 4-5 punch-drunk AAA rejects trotted out by the opposition.

Morse, I think, is back. Last year, the most impressive thing I remember was how hard he hit the ball, how fast it came off his bat. That was how he was hitting last night. Those weren't "Coors Field" hits -- they were rockets that are hits in any park.

Zimmerman, not so sure. The hints we are getting about what is going on in his shoulder -- "things floating around," I think Carpenter said -- are scary. One cortisone shot isn't going to cure anything and I think they're going to have to inject him w/ increasing frequency (and increasing potential risk) to get him through the season.

NatsJack is spot on on Moore -- Willingham w/ upside. A "mistake" hitter who will thrive in a lineup of mashers. Hopefully he stays injury free. Watching him on that ball over his head made me seasick.

I've been wondering if Flores would ever get back to the early-2009 Flores. His performance over the last several games, not just last night, indicates he is getting close.

About Wang, no lead is safe in Coors Field. Johnson could have put Wang in to pitch the 9th, and if he had allowed two runs then Johnson would have had to burn another pitcher, and screw up the avails for the next couple of days, just to be certain things didn't swirl down the drain. Hard to say but I don't think Wang can be used except in a game where the Nats are behind.

NatsJack in Florida said...

Wang is probably being held out till Detwiler's next start Friday in Atlanta. I sure can't see him following J Zimm or our true horse, Edwin Jackson in Colorado.

JaneB said...

Thank you for helping Lindsay understand Gio's choice of a date, MichelleS! Made me laugh out loud!

And may the hitting be for real! GYFNG!

natsfan1a said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
JD said...

NatsJack,

In your opinion what is the over/under for Ozzie? I am thinking Jack Mac is warming up in the bullpen.

Jimmy said...

Great to see Tyler Moore performing well. As much as I've liked watching Lombardozzi, we need him as that high caliber UTL/bench guy. He seems perfectly suited for the role, being able to play 2nd, SS, 3rd and Left while hitting for decent contact. He started hot at the plate, but has regressed as we should have been expecting. He's still a good ball player, and with the way we've been dealing with injuries he'll see a good amount of playing time anyway.

Really hope that middle of the order is getting hot. They are certainly due.

JD said...

In the meantime Corey Brown hit his 17th HR to go with a .298 .388 .578 slash line. What's a guy have to do to get called up?

natsfan1a said...

We're usually in the upper deck regions, so no worries here re. Mr. Ficker. On a somewhat related note, and as previously reported, we sat in front of an obnoxious, braying heckler at Saturday's P-Nats game. Going by his attire, he was evidently a P-Nats fan, but you wouldn't have known it to hear him.

The good guys lost that one. On the plus side, we met Rollie Fingers before the game and got his autograph (there was a long line for him, with a number of folks being in A's attire). My husband had a baseball to be signed and I had a 70's era baseball card. When he signed it, I asked whether he wanted to read his stats on the back. He's like, "No, I already know all of them." :-)

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

Breakthrough or Blip? The breakthrough is getting Tyler Moore some meaningful playing time.

The one area Davey has been slow to react to is the "hot" and "cold" trends of the 13 position players he has. Its a "Pick 8" every day. When Lombo was hot and Espi ice cold, Davey couldn't do it. When Zim was ice cold, Davey couldn't do it. When Tyler Moore was red hot in Toronto, Davey didn't play him until 3 days later and then 3 days after that and only once in the Baltimore series.

You have to ride the hot hand.

Now to discuss Bryce Harper. I think he is hurting real bad. I see Gonat and Laddie Blah Blah had observed this first. Certainly there are enough guys who can play outfield here and Bernadina can certainly man centerfield.

JD said...

I wouldn't draw too many conclusions from last night's game. That's some awful pitching the Rocks threw at us. If we maintain this through the weekend in Atlanta against some better pitching I will start to get excited.

Still it was nice to see Adam,Zim,Morse,TM and Desmond rake.

JD said...

NJ,

He's only 26 not 36. I'm not saying he will dominate in DC but I think he's earned a shot.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

JD said...
In the meantime Corey Brown hit his 17th HR to go with a .298 .388 .578 slash line. What's a guy have to do to get called up?

June 27, 2012 9:49 AM


That certainly goes to the "hot hand" comment I just made. I hate to say it, but it may be time to give Lombo a break and option him back to AAA to slow things back down and get him back on track and you can do it now since DeRosa can play all the positions that Lombo was.

JD said...

Ghost,

I think it's more loyalty than anything else. Davey does not want to give up on Espinosa because the ramifications of this player failing are pretty serious and he also knows that Lombo does not project as an every day player.

Zim is hard to replace because all the possible candidates are huge downgrades. Not playing TyMo after Toronto was a mistake.

On the other hand we are seeing less and less of Nady (even before the DL) and Ankiel which is a good thing.

NatsJack in Florida said...

He'll soon be 27 like in August and he's never produced anything like this till now.

There's no problem being a late bloomer but it makes it tougher to break through once a label has been attached to a guy like Brown.

JD said...

Ghost,

I am interested to see if Lombo is in left next time we face a righty or if TyMo is now a fixture.Like you I am hoping for the latter.

NatsJack in Florida said...

Ghost, I like your idea on Brown/Lombo because Lombo sure has slowed from the left side lately.

JD said...

NJ,

he'll be 27 on November 26th which to me means that his time to make it or break it is now. I think we should find out before we start looking at outside options like Span or Bourn.

JD said...

We all assumed that LaRoche will be extended next year or Morse will move to 1st base. What about TyMo as a dark horse for 1st base in 2013?

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

NatsJack in Florida said...
Wang is probably being held out till Detwiler's next start Friday in Atlanta. I sure can't see him following J Zimm or our true horse, Edwin Jackson in Colorado.


True horse, Edwin Jackson? Unless you think he will turn the trend drastically around that he has had in Colorado, he has pitched 3 times and has averaged only 4 innings in each of those starts with a slash of .429/.500/.679/1.179 and an ERA of 15.75 and a WHIP of 2.667.

Small sample sizes but CarGo, Helton, Fowler and Cuddyer all have smashed him. Each has an OPS of 1.117 to 2.000

Think outside of the box and push back EJax to Atlanta. Might be a great time for Davey to bring in Wang and see what he can do with the sinker in Colorado. Wang has never faced the Rockies before.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

JD said...
Ghost,

I am interested to see if Lombo is in left next time we face a righty or if TyMo is now a fixture.Like you I am hoping for the latter.

June 27, 2012 9:59 AM
NatsJack in Florida said...
Ghost, I like your idea on Brown/Lombo because Lombo sure has slowed from the left side lately


Davey needs to rest Harper for a couple of days. Perfect time to get Lombo righted in Syracuse. He needs it. The bench isn't the place for him right now. Bring up Brown and insert him in CF and spread TyMo, Brown and Morse for a few games. Let Bryce take a breather and get that back taken care of.

I think we have all been so preoccupied with Ryan Z. that everyone forgot that Bryce is hurting even worse.

Brown needs a meaningful look to start a few games and see how he does.

The Real Feel Wood. Accept no substitutes. said...

JD said...
In the meantime Corey Brown hit his 17th HR to go with a .298 .388 .578 slash line. What's a guy have to do to get called up?


Get traded to a team with a lot less organizational depth. Perhaps he should have refused to leave Oakland.

mick said...

I was the one who said we should score at least 5 runs per game against this team. The boys came through (UNDERSTATEMENT), lol. This is why so many of us were so angry after Monday. Now, we are facing a pitcher with and ERA of over 8 runs tonight, we should rock him.

Also, anyone need any more evidence on why Moore should play everyday???

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

JD said...
Ghost,

I think it's more loyalty than anything else. Davey does not want to give up on Espinosa because the ramifications of this player failing are pretty serious and he also knows that Lombo does not project as an every day player.

Zim is hard to replace because all the possible candidates are huge downgrades. Not playing TyMo after Toronto was a mistake.

On the other hand we are seeing less and less of Nady (even before the DL) and Ankiel which is a good thing.


The Espi situation was more complicated as he was a starter. Still, Lombo at the time was raking and I had suggested sitting Espi more vs. RHPs. I think Davey sat him 1 game total.

Yep, finally Ank is glued to the bench. He is hurt also and isn't telling anyone. I think its the same oblique/back issue he had before. The quality of his ABs have been really bad except those low leverage ambush swings where ball finds sweetspot on the bat, and even his arm from the outfield is not where it was early in the season.

If you don't give Lombo a breather in AAA, maybe Ank goes to the DL to be replaced by Brown.

Brown is on the 40 man so no issues there.

Anonymous said...

Even after last night Eckstein's job has to be on thin ice.

Of course we can blame the underachivement on Zimm's injury and hiding it for so long instead of coping and dealing with it but the way this team was taking approaches at the plate it seemed to me their hitting coach sucks or they were no listening to him. Either one of those warrants a replacement to find someone that fits this team's personalities better. I'm glad Zim "came out" and admitted he was still hurting and started treating it. We are seeing the results of that. Also, doctors have said he won't cause any further damage so he just needs to keep treating it.

Let's not forget they did this last night agains a team that has a crazy philosophy for their pitching staff. A team with a more standard philosophy probably would have taken out Moscoso after the first couple of runs trying to win but they are a team in disarray that is missing one of their best players. They still scored 5 runs on our great pitching staff.

I hope the one thing that is certain which is a boost to their confidence works in helping them to finish this first half really strong. The regroup and start the second half as a new season but with a 5 or 6 game lead in the standings. I still remember 2005, it was almost 20 games over .500 before the break and finished the season at exactly .500! That would be really painful!!!
Go National!

Anonymous said...

Even after last night Eckstein's job has to be on thin ice.

Of course we can blame the underachivement on Zimm's injury and hiding it for so long instead of coping and dealing with it but the way this team was taking approaches at the plate it seemed to me their hitting coach sucks or they were no listening to him. Either one of those warrants a replacement to find someone that fits this team's personalities better. I'm glad Zim "came out" and admitted he was still hurting and started treating it. We are seeing the results of that. Also, doctors have said he won't cause any further damage so he just needs to keep treating it.

Let's not forget they did this last night agains a team that has a crazy philosophy for their pitching staff. A team with a more standard philosophy probably would have taken out Moscoso after the first couple of runs trying to win but they are a team in disarray that is missing one of their best players. They still scored 5 runs on our great pitching staff.

I hope the one thing that is certain which is a boost to their confidence works in helping them to finish this first half really strong. The regroup and start the second half as a new season but with a 5 or 6 game lead in the standings. I still remember 2005, it was almost 20 games over .500 before the break and finished the season at exactly .500! That would be really painful!!!
Go National!

NatsFanJim said...

Well, finally - a breakout. This could be just the thing to change the mindset in the Nat's dugout, relax some pressing hitters, and get their head right.

I wouldnt be surprised in the least if you see some bats seriously waking up last night's game forward. Go Nats.

JD said...

Ghost,

I am in complete agreement with you that if you bring up Brown he must play. When TyMo and Brown 1st came up they didn't get any reps. If you are gonna do that you may as well bring up Teahen or Carrol.

The Real Feel Wood. Accept no substitutes. said...

JD said...
We all assumed that LaRoche will be extended next year or Morse will move to 1st base. What about TyMo as a dark horse for 1st base in 2013?


You need to wait and see how things play out the rest of this season. Once Werth gets back he will become a fixture in the outfield along with Harper and Morse. LaRoche for now is a fixture at first base. So for Moore to emerge, he needs to state a strong case for himself when he does play, and even then something needs to happen with Morse and/or LaRoche to create an opening for him. LaRoche's option for 2013 is a mutual option. If LaRoche continues to rake the rest of this season, the Nats may want to pick it up but LaRoche could decide he'd rather try for a multi-year deal as a FA. If LaRoche goes down the tubes the rest of this season, or if he gets hurt, he would probably then want to take the option but the Nats would not. The tricky situation is what happens if LaRoche is merely okay for the remainder of this season. The better Moore can perform in the opportunities he gets from here on out, the better his chances of forcing the decision on LaRoche. It looks like Davey/Rizzo have decided to use this month or so before Werth gets back
to find out what they have in Moore. He needs to step up and sieze the opportunity.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

By the way, Tyler Moore's HR was smashed, and LaRoche's 1st HR into the wind at that time were probably the only HRs that go out in Nats Park on a normal night.

Gio was a victim of a couple of solos, but I have noticed that he doesn't know how to pitch to contact and he can't throw the same pitch w/ the same location twice to a good batter.

Gio threw the same curveball to CarGo twice in a row and the 2nd time he hit it well. Gio's 7 and 8 pitch at-bats after starting 0-2 or 1-2 and losing the batter is costing him innings. He had 1 three pitch K last night. He has to get more economical with his pitches.

baseballswami said...

Gio is a brilliant pitcher, but he is also very emotional and I think that will be his battle. Detweiler has a similar make-up. How about Tyler Moore's home run, folks? I can't stop watching that replay. No cheapie. While we all hoped for a big offensive game last night , even with a weaker pitcher, we knew it wasn't a lock. Until Gio put us ahead (!) , it was dicey. No idea if this was a breakout or a blip. Very sad to see all that smoke out there, too. I feel so badly for those people. I never heard anyone say if the air quality was bad, though. Altitude plus heat plus smoke? Can't be optimal conditions.

JaneB said...

I forget who first called Tyler Moore TyMo but I like. I like his bat, too. I'm just sayin'.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

Peter Angelos's gamble to delay the MASN dispute as characterized by Boz a few weeks ago was to the Nats favor and if the most recent Sports Bog is any indication, Boz was right:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc-sports-bog/post/nats-tv-ratings-on-masn-up-53-percent/2012/06/26/gJQAbuhv4V_blog.html

The Nats are HOT for those who haven't noticed even though West Coast swings will slow the ratings some.

Nats are averaging about 52,400 households in this market. It’s also a higher number than the Caps or Wizards have averaged in recent seasons. (In 2011, for example, the Caps averaged a 1.8 in D.C. for regional broadcasts, while the Wizards averaged a 1.15.)

Also for home games, it has to be noted that on average there are 10,000 more fans than the attendance for an average Caps game which means they are at the stadium and not watching on TV.

The numbers are impressive and the other part that isn't counted in to the ratings is the number of people like myself out of the market that watch on Android devices, DirecTV MLB ticket, and MLB.TV and I also know some just follow along on their radio and pitch-by-pitch on their computer and they aren't in the ratings.

NatsJack in Florida said...

Did numbers letters and dashes person not read the Davey's call out of "ignorant" people calling for Eck's job.

Apparently not.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

JaneB said...
I forget who first called Tyler Moore TyMo but I like. I like his bat, too. I'm just sayin'.

June 27, 2012 10:59 AM


I probably did but I stole TyMo from a Harrisburg blogger. Kind of like Tyco.

I'm also guilty of questioning his plate discipline in the Minors. He was kind of the opposite of Derek Norris in taking his walks. If he can keep that plate discipline and take what the game gives him, TyMo could, and I say COULD, be a regular here.

I also didn't like his glove at 1st base when I saw him 2 years ago. He has really improved and the move to the outfield to get him playing time is just smart baseball.

A DC Wonk said...

Ehhh, I'm not so sure . . . .

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

The one area Davey has been slow to react to is the "hot" and "cold" trends ... You have to ride the hot hand.


It's more complicated than that. You can't have a starter lose his job for a while every time he goes through a slump. Some guys need playing time to work out of the slump. Sure, Morse has been cold, but I think the correct Rx for him is playing time, not sitting him out. I think most are happy that Davey stuck with Ian (.250 in April, .274 in May, .291 in June).

JD said...

I wouldn't draw too many conclusions from last night's game.


True -- but we can draw some. It's pretty easy to see, even watching on TV, that RZ's swing is better (quicker). TyMo has serious pop -- that wouldn't been a HR anywhere.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

DC Wonk, huh? Where did I say to sit Morse? The decision was to give him rehab starts for the Nats instead of AAA. Sure, they rushed him a little.

There's also a big difference between veterans in slumps and newbies in slumps, and even the definition of a slump vs just bad mechanics.

This team has a different philosophy than other teams. My opinion won't sway anything but I know I was right about Espinosa last year and right about Lombardozzi a few weeks ago. If you recall, I was also the one 2 days before Espi's "batters eye" issue that said there was a serious "K" problem.

Sometimes these youngsters need to slow the game down a little bit and get back on a hot streak in 'Cuse and come back and contribute like they can for the Nationals. It worked with Tyler Moore, didn't it?

Gonat said...

Newer players have Minor League options because they arent always ready to stay up at the MLB level. Look no further than Mike Trout last year.

If Tyler Moore has secured LF then Lombo should regain his form in AAA while the Nats have the luxury to option him back.

Holden Baroque said...

Ghost, please tell me you aren't going to keep doing that. One is one too many.

Drew said...

The notion of reps, ie ABs, has become an issue with Lombo. Like Tyler Moore, he prospers with repetition.

With more sporadic playing time, Lombo's on base percentage is down to .322. Here's today's startling stat: while Desmond's career on base percentage is an anemic .303, Lombo's is down to .306.

Yeah, it's a small sample size, point is that Lombo needs ABs. When the season started, Rizzo tasked Davey with finding Lombo 400 at bats. He's at 162 now.

Finding nearly 240 more will be a real challenge with the return of Morse and Werth, Moore's emergence and Brown and Marrero waiting for the call.

Holden Baroque said...

Drew, not to mention Zimm's shot in the arm.

Holden Baroque said...

BTW, "blip."

It was mostly off one reliever, in Colorado. And as FWood pointed out above, they have not sustained it, historically--just the opposite.

I'm a fan of saving some of it for tomorrow, not that that's really an option.

natsfan1a said...

Seconded :-)

Soul Possession, My Hitterish Sofa said...

Ghost, please tell me you aren't going to keep doing that. One is one too many.
June 27, 2012 11:54 AM

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

DC Wonk, Where has Lombardozzi been annointed a starter? He has started just about 1/2 the games with just 162 ABs. That seems like a platoon player.

That's what happens when your Batting Average plummets in a freefall from .320 on May 30th to .259 today. In a full month his BA has dropped 61 points and I saw it happen gradually as he tried to swing longer and when he hit his 1st career HR on June 3rd, I knew it was the kiss of death for a player like him. The worst thing for Lombo is trying to be a power corner outfielder, because he's not.

MicheleS said...

Tyler Moore will be ESPN980 with Loverro today. Not sure of the time, but I think it is in the 1 o'clock hour

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

No, I'm not a bold print guy. That was a frowney face homage to Periculum.

The Real Feel Wood. Accept no substitutes. said...

Yeah, it's a small sample size, point is that Lombo needs ABs. When the season started, Rizzo tasked Davey with finding Lombo 400 at bats. He's at 162 now.

No, it was more like 300-350 ABs. 72 games in, with 162 AB, he's on or ahead of that pace.

Point is, with Lombo being a utility guy it's more about the team's needs than it is about his needs.

The Real Feel Wood. Accept no substitutes. said...

I'm a fan of saving some of it for tomorrow, not that that's really an option.

Isn't that what Bo Porter was trying to do when he put up the stop sign on Flores when he was already more than half way home? That's the only possible explanation I can think of.

Laddie Blah Blah said...

NatsJack

"Laddie..... TyMo = Josh Willingham with a higher upside."

Good analogy. I would rather have TyMo right now than Josh, and I think very highly of Willingham.

David said...

Agree with the Lombo for Brown swap... And then Moore can get at bats rotating with Morse Harper and ALR when they need rests.

Laddie Blah Blah said...

NatsJack

Re Corey B

"He'll soon be 27 like in August and he's never produced anything like this till now.

There's no problem being a late bloomer but it makes it tougher to break through once a label has been attached to a guy like Brown."

Two words - Michael Morse.

peric said...

I see peric crawled out from under his rock when he felt safe.

Have to defend my minor league homies you old decrepit geezer. You're too much of a sycophant to do it even though you see them enough down in Viera.

Bah what a loser.

peric said...

Loser == NatsJack the ancient, decrepit one.

peric said...

No, I'm not a bold print guy. That was a frowney face homage to Periculum.

Since I constantly have to defend myself Ghost why not stick the Robin Ficker shiv a bit deeper.

peric said...

Get traded to a team with a lot less organizational depth. Perhaps he should have refused to leave Oakland.

Or trade FeelWood to the Orioles and Peter Angelos. A guy that is stupid enough to make that move.

The guy has SIX TRIPLES and SEVENTEEN HOME RUNS with a BA just shy of .300? That's not counting doubles.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

Peril, you should be happy with NatsJacks comparing TyMo and Willingham.

The Real Feel Wood. Accept no substitutes. said...

Laddie Blah Blah said...

Re Corey B

Two words - Michael Morse.


Six words: That was then, this is now.

On a first place team with an outfielder surplus (not even counting everyone's favorite whipping boy Ankiel) that is already playing two rookie outfielders (Harper and Moore - three if you count Lombo) there is just not room for another rookie outfielder, no matter how much he is raking in AAA.

Joey Eischen words: Corey Brown can suck on that and he can like it.

peric said...

Ghost, please tell me you aren't going to keep doing that. One is one too many.

Here's hoping a plethora of tickets land you next to Robin Ficker you bed bug ridden sofa.

peric said...

Peril, you should be happy with NatsJacks comparing TyMo and Willingham.

Finally. Moore has worked extremely hard and is also an older prospect like Corey Brown at age 25. Brown and Moore have become pretty good friends. And apparently a synergy between the two came together when Moore arrived in Syracuse. Brown with more XBH's and Moore with a higher OBP. I love to see that ... now that's team chemistry!

Hell yes FeelWood they should be up in the majors ... and if you want to trade them your best bet to get maximum market value is to bring them up to let other teams see. That is a big part of what clinched the Gio deal over other teams offers.

Holden Baroque said...

I'm a fan of saving some of it for tomorrow, not that that's really an option.
--------------
Isn't that what Bo Porter was trying to do when he put up the stop sign on Flores when he was already more than half way home? That's the only possible explanation I can think of.


It really did go up that late, huh? I was hoping I just hadn't seen it. Yanno, for a big win, there were way too many fugly plays in that one.

peric said...

Great point Wood. Brown would certainly get a solid look in a place like Houston, San Diego or Minnesota but his role would be limited here.

And then go out and get Bourn? Seems like they should bring Brown up see what he can do in the lead-off spot first. Before spending gobs of Harper, Zimmermann, and eventually Strasburg money.

Holden Baroque said...

On a first place team with an outfielder surplus (not even counting everyone's favorite whipping boy Ankiel) that is already playing two rookie outfielders (Harper and Moore - three if you count Lombo) there is just not room for another rookie outfielder, no matter how much he is raking in AAA.

Yeah, not sure how that would work, with both Moore and Brown up here playing more or less every day, Harper playing every day, Morse playing most every day, and Lombardozzi not getting enough ABs as it is, not to mention the bench guys. Zimm may be hitting again, LaRoche will play almost every day, and like it or not, Espinosa playing most every day. And Werth is supposedly coming back in about a month.

Either somebody stays in AAA and gets playing time, or somebody comes up here, and doesn't get much time. Not sure how having Brown not playing can help much.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

Peric, I want Brown here but not to throw him in the hell hole known as Nats leadoff, at least not yet.

Let him get some hits and get on a roll first.

The Real Feel Wood. Accept no substitutes. said...

Hell yes FeelWood they should be up in the majors ... and if you want to trade them your best bet to get maximum market value is to bring them up to let other teams see.

Yours is a last-place mentality. First place teams in June/July do not disassemble the team that got them there just to "showcase" AAA players and maximize their trade value. They hold onto those AAA players in case they might need them later in the season to meet their own needs due to injury, giving regulars a rest during meaningless September games, etc.

Holden Baroque said...

Yours is a last-place mentality.

But to be fair, that's a nice hat.

jeffwx said...

So who sits when Werth comes back ?
Like having TYMO, Harper, Morse in the lineup.

A) TYMO
B) Werth
C) Morse to 1st, ALR sits
D) None of the above

Drew said...

FeelWood and NatsJack:

You're right. Rizzo suggested 300 at bats for Lombo, not 400. My mistake.

That's certainly more doable, despite the competition.

In time I hope Rendon can stay healthy and live up to his potential as a lightning bat. Then the decisions will really get interesting.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

Tyler Moore on ESPN 980

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

Thom Loverrro: Were you disappointed Tyler that you were drafted in the 16th round?

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

Great 1st question. 2nd question. What is Brandon Mississippi like?

The Real Feel Wood. Accept no substitutes. said...

Clearly Moore sits when Werth comes back, barring injury or complete collapse of Morse, Werth, LaRoche or Harper. That's why Moore needs to take maximum advantage of his opportunity the next month, in order to state his case and keep his name in the discussion for next year.

MicheleS said...

Good lord.. Tyler has such a great southern accent.

MicheleS said...

These questions to Tyler are really goofy. What is your taste in Music? Really, next it's going to be what kind of tree are you?

jeffwx said...

I see Moore as having a clear case for next year if we don't extend ALR's contract...
Hopefully, Werth gets plenty of rehab and playing time in minors so he is moore ready for starting up here w/o a significant detriment to the lineup.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

Drew said...
FeelWood and NatsJack:

You're right. Rizzo suggested 300 at bats for Lombo, not 400. My mistake.

That's certainly more doable, despite the competition.


June 27, 2012 1:17 PM


Who cares going forward if its 200 or 300 as it is "subject to change without notice". Lombo's future ABs will be dependent on what he does with these pinch hit and spot start opportunities.

As I said before, his BA dropped 61 points in a month and worse than that is where he has been the last month:
.153/.219/.237/.456

The Nats have pitchers hitting better than that.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

MicheleS said...
These questions to Tyler are really goofy. What is your taste in Music? Really, next it's going to be what kind of tree are you?

June 27, 2012 1:23 PM


Loverro got so tongue tied he got lost on question #3 and then segued to how do you like Washington.

Only baseball questions I think were: Was that your furthest HR? Who did you root for when you were a kid? Are you starting tonight?

Seriously?

A DC Wonk said...

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

DC Wonk, Where has Lombardozzi been annointed a starter?


Who suggested that?

My point was: "ride the hot hand" is a simplistic strategy. Sometimes "more AB's to get into the groove" is needed. Sometimes "manager showing faith in a guy" is needed.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

If I had Tyler Moore on for an interview, I would want to ask him about this patience and plate discipline at the MLB level that he didn't have as much of in AA.

MicheleS said...

Ghost.. agree, but let's face it only a few of the Sports talk shows know anything about basbell. Sheehan asked the Football question as expected, he is just now getting into baseball. I would have thought a few more inciteful questions would have been nice.

Tyler's drawl reminds of all the boys I grew up with in Texas... love that drawl.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

DC Wonk, maybe and maybe. Each player is different but I don't want goes who are going deeper into an abyss and cost the team like what happened with Espinosa when the team has alternatives. Both Espi and Lombo have MiLB options. Zim and Morse don't so you stick with them or move them back in the lineup and give them mental days off.

I don't know what to tell you. I see the game differently than most and explained a few times how I evaluate. My record on here speaks for itself and you won't see me playing this game of saying it after the fact like most do. That's easy being reactive and playing the 20/20 hindsight game.

If you can't see a funk with Lombo's last month's worth of stats, I don't know what to tell you.

I think Lombo fell into what Roger B did last year. They put you in LF and they think to maintain their spot that have to become a power hitter since they are corner OF. They change their approach and it messes with what got them here. Lombo is a softy and that is fine. Spray singles and get on base and he isn't doing it any more.

Tyler Moore as I have said for a couple of weeks should be the starting LF. Lombo was here to stay as a utility guy. Now that DeRosa is back, they can send Lombo back to 'Cuse to get fixed. It isn't sending him to exile. Once we see what DeRosa is all about - Spring Training DeRosa or .081 DeRosa then you decide on Lombo.

Now is Corey Brown's turn. The kid has earned it. It will give Harper a chance to sit for a couple of days and heal.

JD said...

I have to agree with Peric re Corey Browm. Why spend $10 mil a year plus for too many years on Bourn when you already could have the answer in your system? It's not like he's dominating low A ball, he's all over the leader board in almost every offensive category including RBI's from the lead off spot in AAA.

Bring him on up; drop Ankiel put him in CF and at leadoff (IMO) and give him 100 AB's and then we'll re evaluate.

Section 222 said...

Saw something on NJ that might be worth discussing. Kilgore asserts, as have many others, that despite his recent slump, Harper would be a shoo-in for the last ASG spot if he's in the group of 5 for the fan vote. Do folks agree with that?

My recollection is that the fan vote is often a battle of hometown favorites, basically a contest between the fans of one or another big market player. A big effort on behalf of Morse from Nationals fans last year didn't work. (I remember making dozens of texts on his behalf from my doctor's office.)

Do we really think that the DC response would be that much bigger this time, or that Harper is so popular nationwide that he could outpoll a Dodger, Met, or Red for that last spot?

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

NatsJack in Florida said...
Ghost.....I'm sure his exposure to the ML camp for 5 weeks this ST helped alot in his plate approach.

Heck, maybe even that horrible hitting instructor had something to do with it.

June 27, 2012 1:40 PM


LMAO "horrible hitting instructor". Seriously, its about darn time we get a pleasant surprise like TyMo and maybe Corey Brown and I think we finally have real position players that are making an impact. This Goodwin kid also. I already know Rendon will be there if healthy.

After that Yankees series, I have a whole new perspective for plate discipline in a team approach. I used to give Kevin Long accolades for what he did to Swisher and Granderson but its a whole different thing having every player doing it.

Jayson Werth came here with that mindset and we weren't used to it here. Zim in the past was great at working his pitch. Tyler Moore has it. Bryce needs to get back to it. Later in games even Desi has it. You can't be afraid of strike 2 but you want those 2-1 and 3-1 leverage counts. When you get that pitch, then see it, hit it. The more pitches you see, your odds get better and worse case you get that pitcher out of the game quicker.

The Rockies Manager Tracey made a bad mistake. He publicly told everyone he was going to a 4 man rotation and his starters were capped at 75 pitches. As an opposing team with that knowledge, I have to be more patient and get him out of the game in the 3rd inning and tire out that bullpen.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

JD said...
I have to agree with Peric re Corey Browm. Why spend $10 mil a year plus for too many years on Bourn when you already could have the answer in your system? It's not like he's dominating low A ball, he's all over the leader board in almost every offensive category including RBI's from the lead off spot in AAA.

Bring him on up; drop Ankiel put him in CF and at leadoff (IMO) and give him 100 AB's and then we'll re evaluate.

June 27, 2012 1:42 PM


Again, AAA is AAA for a reason. I like Corey Brown but I haven't seen him to anything but lay down a suicide squeeze which he did admirably.

He has no hits so far. I know his tools, I see the potential but lets not compare Corey Brown to Michael Bourn with a straight face.

Section 222 said...

Not sure if this has been posted yet, so I will. Colbert put Bryce on his All-Star ballot!!

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/dailypitch/post/2012/06/cole-hamels-bryce-harper-all-star-game/1#.T-tJbJFQDx8

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

NatsJack, you know what the Twins want: A closer and prospects.

I like Span better now than the risk he was last year after the head injury.

I would give them Henry, Ankiel, Lombo, and Wang and Cutter Dysktra. Just would have a hard time giving away the strength of the team which is pitching.

The Real Feel Wood. Accept no substitutes. said...

Do we really think that the DC response would be that much bigger this time, or that Harper is so popular nationwide that he could outpoll a Dodger, Met, or Red for that last spot?

Harper was getting his name chanted by fans in the stands at Toronto. He was getting cheered in Boston even though he was destroying the Red Sox at the time. He got booed in Baltimore when he came to the plate, while no other Nats player drew a peep out of the crowd. He played in front of capacity crowds in LA the very day he was called up, and a Phillies pitcher who he embarrassed on national TV admitted that he voted for Harper on his All Star ballot.

Hell yes, if Harper is on the fan ballot he'll get the votes. Michael Morse may have been the better player and therefore more worthy when he was on the ballot last year, but no one outside DC knew him from Adam.

Tcostant said...

No home run derby for Harper:

http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/06/27/matt-kemp-wont-pick-bryce-harper-for-home-run-derby/

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

NatsJack, here is why I wouldn't overpay: Span away from Target is horrible .216/.261/.261/.522

What I do like is that 1/3 of all games this year Span has led-off the game and gotten on base via walk or hit.

jeffwx said...

I don't see the need to get another outfielder for this season with Werth coming back, needing to give Tyler Moore at bats, and Corey Brown looking promising.

The Real Feel Wood. Accept no substitutes. said...

Now is Corey Brown's turn. The kid has earned it. It will give Harper a chance to sit for a couple of days and heal.

There is no place for Corey Brown on the current roster - not even as a replacement for Lombo if he's sent down. Lombo is a true utility guy, can play IF and OF as needed. Corey Brown is only an outfielder, and as noted before there is a surplus of outfielders even before Werth gets back. The only possible way to make room for Brown would be to send Tyler Moore back down, and no one is advocating for that.

Sucks for Corey, but that's the way it is.

jeffwx said...

Maybe make a trade for a starting pitcher when Strasburg goes down. Otherwise, live with Wang/Lannan to fill his final 7-8 starts ?

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

jeffwx, this team still lacks a consistent leadoff hitter but still has a little over 30 days to decide. That is why getting CBrown here sooner than later to see what he can do is imperative especially with Harp and LaRoche needing some days off.

With Morse and TyMo able to play some 1st base, you could go with another outfielder and get everyone enough at-bats in my opinion.

jeffwx said...

Wood, you could also DFA Ankiel for Brown while keeping Lombo/Moore in the bigs.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

jeff, absolutely, another quality starter is priority #1 with Strasburg's time limit.

Those are going to be expensive but the good news is most teams will be fighting over Hamels and the Nats can probably slip in there to get someone like Dempster (if healthy and still pitching well)

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

jeff, Ank will be DL'd before he is DFA'd. Ank really is hurting (oblique or back). Still, like I said, Lombo could use some time in 'Cuse and that immediately opens the spot.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

Feel Wood, did you forget DeRosa plays 2B, 3rd, and corner outfield. He doesn't play SS but Espi becomes Desi's replacement if needed. This is why Lombo couldn't be sent down before.

jeffwx said...

Ghost, I agree we don't have a true leadoff hitter in Espi/Lombo. However, let's say we pick up another OFer by July 31 (call him Spahn, unlikely).

In August, we have :
Moore,Harper, Werth, Morse, Spahn

Can't have 5 outfielders,
so Harper/Spahn/Werth

Morse platoons with ALR.
Moore sits.

I don't think it is worth taking ALR and Moore's bat out for another outfielder who can lead off.

Next year, absolutely get Bourne or a leadoff OF and trade ALR moving Morse to first....Moore supporting the OF and 1B.

The Real Feel Wood. Accept no substitutes. said...

jeffwx said...
Wood, you could also DFA Ankiel for Brown while keeping Lombo/Moore in the bigs.


Much as you all hate Ankiel and love Brown, there is absolutely no effin way they would do that before Werth gets back. If Ankiel is hurting now, it's not bad enough to keep him from being a late-inning defensive replacement, which with an outfield of Moore-Harper-Morse is basically all he is now.

Face the truth, guys. You can have Moore, you can have Brown, but you can't have both.

The Real Feel Wood. Accept no substitutes. said...

Ghost, I agree we don't have a true leadoff hitter in Espi/Lombo. However, let's say we pick up another OFer by July 31 (call him Spahn, unlikely).

There is a better chance of them digging up Warren Spahn and putting him on the team than there is of them trading for an outfielder before the deadline.

jeffwx said...

I think you can't have Moore, Brown and Ankiel, Nady and DeRosa. One of the latter 3 could be let go/DLed, whatever for Brown. One of the latter 3 will be let go, prob Nady when Werth is back.
Wood, you are probably right to not let go of Ankiel right now.

jeffwx said...

Sorry all, meant Keiunta Denard Span.

NatsJack in Florida said...

I'm not eally a Spann guy myself. I jus know Rizzo wants someone to handle CF defensively and a true lead off guy just to get JayB off his back.

NatsJack in Florida said...

just kidding JayB.

Doc said...

With the Nats' new found prowess at the plate, it's time to take on the Yanks again!

Naw, might as well wait for the WS to start.

The Real Feel Wood. Accept no substitutes. said...

Ghost Of Steve M. said...
jeffwx, this team still lacks a consistent leadoff hitter but still has a little over 30 days to decide. That is why getting CBrown here sooner than later to see what he can do is imperative especially with Harp and LaRoche needing some days off.


Teams in the middle of a pennant race do not have the luxury of plopping a AAA guy into the lineup "to see what he can do." That has to wait until either the next spring training or the team falls out of contention, whichever happens first. The only exception is if a spot opens up due to injury. Werth's injury opened up a spot that is now being used to plop Moore into the lineup to see what he can do. That same spot can't also be used for Brown.

NatsJack in Florida said...

My sentiments exactly, Wood.

A DC Wonk said...

The Rockies Manager Tracey made a bad mistake. He publicly told everyone he was going to a 4 man rotation and his starters were capped at 75 pitches. As an opposing team with that knowledge, I have to be more patient and get him out of the game in the 3rd inning and tire out that bullpen.

This ole' debate about "working the count."

You can't work the count with a guy who is consistently throwing strikes. Who wants to get in the hole at 0-2 after two pitches.

The reason why the Yankees can "work the count" and take a lot of pitches, is that they hit so many home runs most pitchers (including the Nats pitchers) start nibbling right from the first pitch. When you're facing a nibbler -- sure, work the count. But you can't do that against a guy that's pounding the strike zone.

I heard on the telecast the other night that after the Rockies went to a 75-pitch count their starters significantly reduced their number of walks, because they were pounding the zone hoping to make it to five innings.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

NatsJack is on a roll today. First priority is the.Stras replacement.

Spans road numbers are awful.

A DC Wonk said...

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

DC Wonk, maybe and maybe. Each player is different but I don't want goes who are going deeper into an abyss and cost the team like what happened with Espinosa when the team has alternatives.


So, let's take Espi as an example. You'd sit him down? For how long? Do we want to lose his bat from the right side? (.323/.429/.554/.982)

Or, just sit him against RHP? If so, How does he work out his batting-as-a-lefty problems? In the minors? Do we want to lose his glove whenever a righty faces us?

On the other hand, will Davey's confidence in him help him get it together?

I'm not saying I know the answer to _any_ of those questions. I'm just saying that, it seems to me, it's a lot more complicated than "play the hot hand."

Laddie Blah Blah said...

Feel Wood

"On a first place team with an outfielder surplus (not even counting everyone's favorite whipping boy Ankiel) that is already playing two rookie outfielders (Harper and Moore - three if you count Lombo) there is just not room for another rookie outfielder, no matter how much he is raking in AAA."

He will be called up in September, at the latest, and sooner should injuries deplete the current OF crop. You would rather have Nady or DeRosa playing out there as replacements, would you?

You missed my main point, which is that Brown gives Rizzo a lot of flexibility. My opinion - either Morse or ALR, possibly both, will be gone next year. Morse will never have greater trade value, and ALR's return seems iffy given the mutual veto on his option.

You can add Ankiel to that list, and perhaps Bernie as a trade throw-in. Brown could also be traded. Do you really think Nady and DeRosa have shown enough to be asked back?

"Six words: That was then, this is now."

The surplus in the outfield is as of now, not next year, or even next month.
The way to look is forward, in any business.

JD said...

Feel Wood,

I disagree. If a certain position is completely unproductive such as our lead off position you are not really risking anything by making a change. Also it's not September; it's a great time to make such a change. Many teams in or around contention have made such moves in the past.

San Francisco inserted Posey into their lineup late in their championship year; he wasn't replacing an injured player just an ineffective Molina.

The Real Feel Wood. Accept no substitutes. said...

The surplus in the outfield is as of now, not next year, or even next month.
The way to look is forward, in any business.


Exactly. And when it's almost July and your team is in first place, you stick with what got you there rather than mucking around to try to figure out what might work best next year. The view forward looks different from first place than it does from last place. You, like peric, seem to still be looking forward from a last place viewpoint.

David said...

After ALR's resurgence, I'll be sad to see him traded. Maybe Morse will get traded instead? I agree that one of them will be probably be gone before the season is over. Can we just make a magic "injury" for Ankiel so we can bring up Brown for 15 days? Anyway. I guess Brown isn't getting called up until September...

David said...

Agree with JD's comment. It's not too late to bring up Brown and work him in if there is a place for him, and need.

Laddie Blah Blah said...

Peric

"And then go out and get Bourn? Seems like they should bring Brown up see what he can do in the lead-off spot first. Before spending gobs of Harper, Zimmermann, and eventually Strasburg money."

You can bet your bippy that something very similar has occurred to Rizzo. The Rays, for one, have been very successful developing from within, and then trading a successful but aging player to stay young.

The Real Feel Wood. Accept no substitutes. said...

If a certain position is completely unproductive such as our lead off position you are not really risking anything by making a change.

If there was such a thing as a Designated Leadoff Hitter who didn't have to play the field, you might have a point. But there's not. True, there might be value in inserting Brown into the leadoff spot to see if he pans out there. But you can't do it without removing either Moore, Harper or Morse from your outfield, which then weakens their current spots in the batting order. You're robbing Peter to pay Paul. That's the kind of thing that teams do once they're eliminated from the pennant race.

Laddie Blah Blah said...

Feel Wood

"And when it's almost July and your team is in first place, you stick with what got you there rather than mucking around to try to figure out what might work best next year."

No, you go with what gives you the best chance to win, in the present, and plan on what gives you the best chance to win, in the future. If Werth can't come back, for some reason, and they have to put Harp on the DL because of his back, are you going to put an injured Ankiel in center, or go with the healthy young stud?

Easy call, that.

The Real Feel Wood. Accept no substitutes. said...

After ALR's resurgence, I'll be sad to see him traded. Maybe Morse will get traded instead? I agree that one of them will be probably be gone before the season is over.

Neither one will be traded before this season is over. Teams in a pennant race do not trade away their best hitters mid-season even if they have some rookie or AAA guy who looks promising and seems ready to break out. That is why, for instance, you did not see the 2010 Phillies trading Jayson Werth or Raul Ibanez and going with Domonic Brown instead.

The Real Feel Wood. Accept no substitutes. said...

No, you go with what gives you the best chance to win, in the present, and plan on what gives you the best chance to win, in the future. If Werth can't come back, for some reason, and they have to put Harp on the DL because of his back, are you going to put an injured Ankiel in center, or go with the healthy young stud?

Easy call, that.


You go with the healthy young stud, who has conveniently been stashed away in AAA all along.

Easy call, that.

Gonat said...

Sabathia to the DL with groin and Pettitte took a nasty shot to his ankle and headed to get XRays and a MRI.

The Real Feel Wood. Accept no substitutes. said...

What's the MLB record for number of different teams played for in a single season? Livan seems to be going after that, along with Jamie Moyer. Livan is ahead right now, as Moyer is having trouble getting called up after he signs the minor league deal.

Gonat said...

XRays back on Pettitte. Fracture in his ankle. To the DL for 6 weeks. The people in Baltimore if they play their cards right may find themselves back in 1st place if they find a pitcher.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

DC Wonk at 3:10, Espi the switch-hitter is 2 guys. I like Danny RH and don't want his twin Danny LH on my team until he figures out. Problem is, Lombo isn't hitting now.

A DC Wonk said...

David said...

After ALR's resurgence, I'll be sad to see him traded.


ALR, despite his .251 average, leads the team in SLG, OPS, HR, BB, and RBI, and is second in OBP (and 2b). (I hear he has a decent glove)

Why do we want to trade him so fast?

Gonat said...

Mets are killing the Cubs 10-1

A DC Wonk said...

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

DC Wonk at 3:10, Espi the switch-hitter is 2 guys. I like Danny RH and don't want his twin Danny LH on my team until he figures out.


My question still stands? How does he "figure it out"?

Either he gets sent to the minors, and we lose his right handed twin and his glove -- or he plays through it.

His right handed bat is way too good to lose right now (OPS of .950 or something like that).

Gonat said...

DC Wonk, read over the trading ALR stuff. It has no merit and is like talking about trading for CarGo which goes into the file "Things that won't happen". ALR and Morse are not being traded.

The Nats will be a buyer for a pitcher upgrade. If no upgrade exists they probably hold firm.

Bourn is what you call a luxury item and not sure the Nats can afford him and last I checked the Braves are still in the hunt.

Anonymous said...

Anybody else notice the blip in the picture at the start of this entry? Is that a sign telling us what Mark thinks is going to transpire over the next few weeks? ;)

David said...

I spoke too quickly.... either ALR or Morse will be gone this offseason! Because we will be in the playoffs. :-)

MicheleS said...

So the Jays starting pitching is on the DL or not going well, the Yankees lost 2/5ths of their SP today. Is it really the $$$ that is not getting Lannan traded?

MicheleS said...

My Dad is rolling over in his grave with that 16-1 Mets thumping of the Cubs..

djinFl. said...

Mets up 16-1, bet Chicago is glad they got Theo to straighten things out.

peric said...

Bourn is what you call a luxury item and not sure the Nats can afford him and last I checked the Braves are still in the hunt.

Right now they are having problems signing Lucas Giolito their 1st round pick. That pick represents the entire draft. If they lose him they can almost mark this draft as close to an effort in futility. Next up? An extension for Jordan Zimmermann.

What do you think is more important? Signing JZimmnn long-term? Or bringing in Bourn and then attempting to sign him to an extension?

Given how far their pitching staff has taken them I think the Nats would be better served trying out Corey Brown in CF and at lead off. In a year Brian Goodwin will be close to ready and he is raking down in Hagerstown. They spent a good chunk of change in a bonus reeling him in. And we all know there are others.

Its why I don't read the "Bleacher Report" on the Nats. The writers are all a bunch of fantasy baseball players ... and some idiot actually asked Boz why they don't trade for Denard Span. Boy he put that notion down fast.

Sign JZimnn. Then you give EJax an extension. If EJax won't sign then may they can get Grienke without giving up a lot if he is again willing to sign an extension ... maybe you do that deal if it doesn't demolish what's left of the Nat's top prospects list. Maybe Rizzo does it anyway.

The truth is (as we are seeing it) is in the pitching. And right now they really don't have any power pitcher that seems almost ready other than older prospect Nate Karns. Christian Garcia (NatsJack's guy) is outperforming H-Rod in Syracuse. He just chalked up his second save in a row. Another older prospect. That's about it other than Jeff Mandel.

So, yes they need some pitching ... Sandy Leon is rehabilitating ... David Freitas is working his way up and they signed Koyie Hill who can't really hit but is a defensive gem at catcher. They appear to be covered there with Solano and Flores plus Maldonado in Syracuse again.

As for the hitting, unlike the Bleache Report (who are mostly inane) I think patience with the young hitters. Remember, Desmond looked terrible in his sophomore year ... worse than terrible. Now, Espinosa is going through the same thing. They've got Tyler Moore and we've still go Morse. There's Brown ready to come up. Harper is in a bit of a slump but he'll come out of it. Lord knows what the fans will be like if his sophomore year is horrendous?

It is definitely NOT time to panic and go outside for help.

natsfan1a said...

I don't know but I'm guessing the recordholder could be a LOOGY.

What's the MLB record for number of different teams played for in a single season?

fresh2death1997 said...

Why are people panicking? We are fine. Better than those last games!

baseballswami said...

I don't quite understand the call for an outfielder right now when we have so many.Just because one of them is not the prototypical lead off guy doesn't meant they are worthless. So what would be your plan with all of our outfielders - use them as currency in trades? Why are we training new guys to play out there? To make them more valuable in trades? Who do we keep, how do we get them playing time and continue to develop them, and what do we do with them going forward? They all are not going to be content to sit around in the minors forever.

Ghost Of Steve M. said...

Wonk, Espi has to stay now since Lombo is now the weak link. When Lombo was going well was the time to platoon them. Water under the bridge now.

fresh2death1997 said...

From mlbtraderumors.com

The Braves and Nationals were recently scouting at a Twins game, tweets Phil Mackey of ESPN's 1500 Twin Cities radio. Atlanta was there to see Francisco Liriano, while Washington was likely keeping tabs on center fielder Denard Span.

peric said...

Is it really the $$$ that is not getting Lannan traded?

Look at it this way Michele. Two Syracuse Chiefs were selected to represent the IL in the AllStar game. One is Corey Brown, CF, lead-off. The second is former major league AllStar and left-handed starter Zach Duke.

Do you see John Lannan's name there anywhere? Has Lannan ever made it to a major league All Star game? For 5 million he really should have! Its way too much for a guy who isn't even the ace on his AAA team!!! Yunesky Maya has pitched better to the half-way point.

Why should a team pick up John Lannan when they can instead get a Zach Duke?

natsfan1a said...

After some random searching, seems as though the record may be four teams. Get to work, Livo! ;-)

What's the MLB record for number of different teams played for in a single season?

fresh2death1997 said...

Supposedly, Rizzo called Rockies GM to acquire information about their outfielders.

From mlbtraderumors.com

While there has been some speculation that the Rockies could consider moving outfielder Carlos Gonzalez, General Manager Dan O'Dowd says that the standout will be staying put in Colorado, writes Jon Heyman of CBSSports.com.

O'Dowd says that talk of the team putting the 26-year-old on the block started when Nationals GM Mike Rizzo inquired on him via phone. The Rockies GM says that he told Rizzo that the outfielder wasn't available, and that was the end of it.

peric said...

The Braves and Nationals were recently scouting at a Twins game, tweets Phil Mackey of ESPN's 1500 Twin Cities radio. Atlanta was there to see Francisco Liriano, while Washington was likely keeping tabs on center fielder Denard Span.

As Boz said in his last chat. Never happen.

Gonat said...

Span happens before CarGo, but I don't see either one happening.

MicheleS said...

It's Official.. PIT DFA'd Slaten...knew that they would add the DFA back to his name

Anonymous said...

Havent seen anything on the conversation Laroche apparently had with Harper after the errant throw. I wonder if Harper took it well.

Jane Elizabeth said...

It is interesting that Strasburg got all kinds of negatives after his performance, while there is little about Gio on here today. Gio fell many places among the top pitchers in the league in terms of ERA and Fielding Independent Pitching after last night, while Strasburg fell hardly at all after his outing on Monday.

At the same time Johnson could have taken him out in the sixth and his figures would have stayed higher. You have to take a lot of the pitcher stats with a grain of salt. The more innings you get through, the more leeway you get, sort of like that old Cuban guy who pitched for us a couple of times and who probably will again.

Good on Davey for defending his pitching coach. He was exactly right. If these guys are not disciplined, that is there is their issue. Nevertheless, this was one game. The Nats hitting issues are no more resolved than they were after that game in Toronto where Tyler Moore hit the two homers and we won in a laugher.

One game in MLB means ZERO.

Anonymous said...

Havent seen anything about the conversation Laroche apparently had with Harper after the errant throw. I wonder if Harper took it well.

Gonat said...

Michele, no kidding. It showed how pathetic it was for the Nats to keep him as long as they did last year. He is beyond bad. His new job should be as a BP pitcher.

I feel almost as strongly about Henry Rodriguez. Just not guys you can rely on if you really want to be a playoff contender and Pittsburgh thinks they can be a contender this year.

Jane Elizabeth said...

batting coach....

MicheleS said...

WODL...Don't worry about Gio not getting called out here.. It will happen soon enough. This crowd can turn on a dime.

Plus I think everyone was sooo stunned byt 21 hits/12 runs that everything else got put aside (example - Harper - is it his back?)

baseballswami said...

Amazing how a dozen runs will make you forget pitching mistakes. Amazing how no runs or one run will call attention to just one pitching mistake. I am not looking for perfect, healthy would please me just fine, thanks.The offense giveth and the offense taketh away. You know, it really bothers me how quick some people are to just write off young players. Thanks to the Yankees, the Mets and Seattle, we have Clip, Flo and Mikey, who were written off. So Lombo isn't hitting every ball that comes near him right now on the occasions when he is in the game - last I heard the entire TEAM was in a slump. When a rookie first comes up he often goes crazy - then the other teams start to get a book on him, make adjustments and he comes back to earth. Doesn't mean he will "never" amount to anything. Espi was ridiculous when he first came up. Major league pitching is humbling for even the veterans. Bryce, Lombo and Moore -- patience - they are going to have hitting woes, fielding mistakes, base-running gaffes and a lot more. They are learning in a grueling major league season. There is not one of us who " knows" that someone will or will not make it.Can we just cheer them all on and let them play and learn? I think they are all pretty amazing kids. They seem to be talented, great people and work very hard. My bet is on every one of them succeeding. By the way, have the Yankees called about John Lannan yet?

Section 222 said...

I don't know but I'm guessing the recordholder could be a LOOGY

Ray King? Mike (not Giancarlo) Stanton?

natsfan1a said...

Mike Stanton came to mind for me, too. Ray King would also be a possibility.

Another former Nat, Ron Villone, came up while I was searching. But he was mentioned in the context of most teams played for overall, as opposed to in one season.

natsfan1a said...

Huh, turns out that a lot of former Nats turn up on the (Warning: the contents of this link may cause flashbacks, palpitations, spikes in blood pressure, and other undesirable symptoms.) most-teams-played-for list (which makes sense, I suppose).

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