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US Presswire photo A's left-hander Gio Gonzalez has burst onto the scene the last two years. |
Gonzalez's name has surfaced in the last 24 hours as a hot trade target of several clubs after word got out the A's might be willing to deal the 26-year-old lefty. The Nationals inquired about his availability, according to a source familiar with the discussions, but talks never progressed.
Even if the A's were willing to deal Gonzalez, general manager Billy Beane is seeking a significant haul in return, perhaps three or four top prospects. The Nationals probably wouldn't meet that kind of hefty demand, despite the attractiveness of a pitcher like Gonzalez.
In only two seasons as a full-time, big-league starter, Gonzalez has established himself as a frontline pitcher. He boasts a 31-21 record, 3.17 ERA and 368 strikeouts over the last two years and this season earned his first All-Star nod.
Impressive numbers aside, the Nationals' priority remains acquiring a veteran starting pitcher who has a track record for 200-inning seasons and can serve as a mentor to Stephen Strasburg and Jordan Zimmermann, which is why 32-year-old lefty Mark Buehrle continues to top their wish list.
47 comments:
It was already hard to take Jim Bowden seriously, but then today he suggests that one of the Hanley Ramirez trade scenarios is the Nats trading Ryan Zimmerman for Hanley Ramirez.
Why did ESPN hire him?
Why did ESPN hire him?
Who else could they get to come up with this stuff??
They could hire all of us and we could generate some fascinating -- if totally random and impractical -- ideas...
BUT they might do an Ian Desmond for Ramirez swap? It would give them a pretty potent infield offensively and a terrific one defensively if Espinosa and Ramos continue to develop.
Too many right handed hitters however.
"They could hire all of us and we could generate some fascinating -- if totally random and impractical -- ideas..."
Desmond, Detwiler, Peacock, Flores, and Bernadina for Matt Kemp.
Say Buehrle and Oswalt sign elsewhere (and given the interest, that's pretty likely). Isn't the next guy on the "200 inning track record" list Edwin Jackson? Hasn't Rizzo been linked to him a number of times? How come he hasn't come up in all this speculation?
This is just getting silly. Bowden HAD to make that one up.
Actually, that would be Fat Fingered NatsJack.
To "serve as a mentor" is such utter and complete BS. No club pays a guy $65M to essentially be a coach, no matter what anyone might say. They pay the guy to perform. Talk about the value in the clubhouse and the work ethic a guy brings and how he plays the game the right way is pretty much all BS. As if all but a literal handful of guys in or trying to make MLB don't work constantly at perfecting their craft.
I also get a kick out of the way a guy like John Lackey was "an intense competitor, a guy who'd run through a brick wall to get a win" when he was a big winner screaming at his infielders if they botched a double-play ball, or barking at Soscia when he was getting the hook, with the Angels, but the same guy is simply an ego-driven jackass when he's a loser in Boston. I sure hope the Sox were not paying for Lackey to mentor John Lester.
dfh21
NatsJack in Florida said...
Actually, that would be Fat Fingered NatsJack.
LOL. For a minute, I wondered if you had a stalker fan.
Beantown, I don't think there is anybody else on Rizzo's 200-inning-horse list.
Change of subject: anyone know if the Rockies could be persuaded to part with Dexter Fowler? He would be a good CF/leadoff addition. CarGo often plays center field for the Rocks, so Colorado only needs a viable outfield replacement in their system for Fowler, not necessarily a CF replacement.
HabsProf:
"Rockies outfielder Dexter Fowler is off-limits in trade talks, according to Troy Renck of the Denver Post." --MLB Trade Rumors
A Hanley for Zim trade is not a ridiculous notion. Hanley is at least a comparable player, and he is at a tougher position and under contract for an extra year. Fish get a stud back to play 3B, Hanley gets to play SS and the Nats would have a lot of options for a 3B through FA or via trade. Not a bad scenario for either club. No?
dfh21
I continue to think that even though all these rumors flow and leads to many here speculating, that it might be wise to just listen to what Davey and Rizzo are saying. Neither has said a thing about Fielder. Rizzo is looking for a starting pitcher but Davey has already said he is fine if it doesn't happen. Why do people keep bringing more names into the picture? If we don't get Buehrle we will then try for Oswalt and I am guessing if we don't get him we will sit back and let our prospects have a fun time in Viera fighting for that 5th spot. I have NEVER heard Davey or Rizzo suggest trading LannEn and yet many on here have him gone.
No matter what happens, we have a far better situation this spring than at any time I can remember.
I want to repeat what I said earlier about the Eagles winning the super bowl in August and yet look where they are. The game is played with real people on the field. All this posturing and worrying is a waste of time.
Go Nats!!
This is brilliant:
'Stan Kasten says teams should spend on payroll when they open a new ballpark'
Marl is certainly over-acheiving this week, eh? Everytime I log on there is a new post! Awesome!
That's "Mark" , of course.
@Sec 3, My Sofa
Thanks for the update re: Dexter Fowler. I suspected as much given that his name was never mentioned as a viable candidate, but I had never actually heard of him being directly mentioned as unavailable.
Hanley Ramirez... precisely the kind of quality character Rizzo wants in the clubhouse in place of Ryan Zimmerman.
Sec 3, My Sofa said...
This is brilliant:
'Stan Kasten says teams should spend on payroll when they open a new ballpark'
OMG. I hate me some Stan Kasten.
I wonder what he says about what a club should do 4 years after it opens a new park?
dfh21
Marlins and Nats are the 2 finalists for Buehrle. With the way Loria is throwing around money and years, I'm not too bullish but Rizzo seems to be making enough of a push to still be in the conversation.
No one throws too much money at an 30-something FA like Mike Rizzo does. I am guessing that the Nats win and get their man for a 4 year deal, partial no-trade, something like $68M with some backended payment scheme or deferred money. Wild guess.
dfh21
DFH21, I suppose on paper that a Ramirez for Zimmerman trade would make sense. The problem is that Zimmerman is so much more than just a player - he's a fan favorite and clubhouse leader. Ramirez, fairly or unfairly, would never be able to fill those shoes. Also, this trade assumes the Nats have no chance to resign Zimm.
I think that we get Buehrle too, as much because the Marlins also offered CJ Wilson a SIX year deal (I stand by the Charlie Sheen analogy to Miami).
Less money than DFH21 thinks, maybe $56m. I think it is too much money and too many years, but he is a good pitcher and hopefully gets a AL-NL bump, too.
So who gets the 3rd OF slot?
re: Hanley for Zimm. Agree completely with Hotdiggitydog. And in addition, it should be noted that while Hanley plays the more difficult position, he sucks at it, while Zim is an elite defender when he's got his throwing motion in good shape. I would bet that Zimm would be better rated at either 3B or SS defensively.
Clubhouse leader? Copme on. Zim is a great young player, but he's is not Robin Yount or Cal Ripken or Yaz or or Kirby Puckett or Mike Schmidt -- a guy so important to a franchise as to be sacred.
Hanley is the same age and has outperformed Zim in pretty much every offensive category. I am not saying that I would make that trade, but it is not an unreasonable notion on its face and it presumes not that the Nats would not be ablr to resign Zim, it presumes that if they did they'd be paying a lot more for Zim's 2014 season than they would for Hanley's, which is very likey true.
dfh21
sjm308 said:
"Why do people keep bringing more names into the picture?... All this posturing and worrying is a waste of time."
I think the answer to this question is that for many people here, it's more fun to make suggestions about how to improve the team and have a conversation (and posture and worry) about different ideas than to just read the tea leaves and predict what Rizzo will do, or just accept that all the moves he makes are the best moves in the best of all possible worlds.
As for whether it's a waste of time, I can't argue with you there. :-) But so is going to or a baseball game or watching it on TV when you can just find out who won the next day in the paper. It's entertainment. And in the absence of actual baseball, this will have to do. I've had a lot of fun reading the thoughts of others, including yours, and spouting off my own. Certainly the proliferaton of posts and comments has made The Hot Stove the most enjoyable time I've spent since Game 6 of the World Series.
I guess we just disagree on Zimm. He's the kind of player that franchises are built on. Great defense. Great hitter. So consistent. So clean. He's practically the modern day Roy Hobbs. You don't ever trade guys like that. You plug him in at 3rd and forget about it. Then, you improve other parts of your team.
Could you do that with Hanley? Um, I don't think so.
BTW, Zimm is still relatively young. If his career continues on this path, do you think it would be reasonable to compare him to Ripken, Ventura, Puckett?
3 years at $13 mil for Buehrle is a bad idea. 4 years @ $14 mil is downright irresponsible.
'Hanley Ramirez's representative talked to the Marlins on Wednesday and asked for a restructured deal after the shortstop was asked to move to third base with the signing of Jose Reyes. The Marlins, upset with this, now be looking to trade Ramirez, the sources said.'
Let the games begin.
Most clubhouse leaders start by leading by example.....See Ryan Zimmerman......Hanley Ramirez..not so much.
fwiw, I'm with sjm in considering all the speculation and pontificating to be a waste of energy, in that nothing I say or do will affect the outcome for the team. Likewise, I find it to be a waste of time to try to persuade someone else to embrace my own point of view.
Actually, I find this period almost as torturous as trade deadline. I had waaay more fun watching the postseason games. I love watching baseball. Armchair GM stuff, eh, not so much. ;-) As always, your mileage may vary and others are free to post or read as they wish.
Hotdiggitydog,
We love Zim because he is our player but what dfh21 says is not crazy. Ramirez is just as young as Zim and his offensive numbers so far have been better than Zim's and he is under control for 1 extra year and we drafted a 3rd baseman with our number 1 pick last year.
Hotdigg -- I am a Nats fan, not a Ryan Zimmerman fan. I am not looking for the club to move Zim, of course, I love the guy's overall game, he's an elite talent -- but they should not consider the guy immovable. If the club thinks that Hanley Ramirez for Zim is a good move, then I hope that they pull the trigger. The same way that the Mets should be thinking about a David Wright trade (notwithstanding his face of the franchise good guyness) -- if it makes sense for your club, then it makes sense. Some of the best players in the game have been moved over the years.
dh21
CNNSI reporting Marlins are out on Pujols and have made a 6-year offer to the mediocre CJ Wilson, the Jayson Werth of pitching free agents. Let's hope this is trye. Can't imagine how that could work out better for the Nats!
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/baseball/mlb/12/05/winter.meetings.buzz/index.html?eref=sircrc
Zimm is a quality player and quality citizen. Hanley is the former, not the latter. Rizzo needs to sign Zimm now!!
sm13,
Robert Fick is a quality citizen too. Who cares?
... Having said all of that I don't think the Nats and the Marlins will make such a significant trade inside the division. If I was a GM I would try to acquire Ramirez on the cheap knowing there is probably a not reparable rift with him and the Marlins.
Twitters saying that Buehrle to the Marlins for 58 Mil.
I think you need to scratch out unlikely in favor of likely now that wilson and buehrle are going elsewhere. Gio is the only young gun worth pursuing now. Oswalt has too many back issues
Asked earlier if he had a Plan B if Buehrle signed elsewhere, Rizzo said they "Feel we have good depth in SP now w/what we have in-house."
That's what a loser says. Good luck beating the Marlins next year.
Would I trade Ryan Zimmerman for Hanley Ramirez? I would not make that deal even if the stinking Fish threw in Jose Reyes and paid half of his salary.
GYFNG!
jd said...
sm13,
Robert Fick is a quality citizen too. Who cares?
I think that you have to care somewhat, if you are talking about giving someone a long term contract, no? I didn't think sm13 was suggesting to sign up players who were ONLY quality citizens, only that both were important if you want to build a team around a guy. Or, if he/she wasn't saying that, at least I think it is relevant.
Zimmerman v. Ramirez? Personally, I wouldn't make that trade, but it certainly isn't crazy. I'd goes as far to say that most baseball people outside DC or Miami would pick Ramirez first based solely on skills and position. But I do think a lot of people would then knock him down a peg for his attitude.
Wasn't Reyes' act of removing himself from the last game to preserve the batting title one of the reasons that you thought the Nats should avoid him?
But what do I know? I thought that we were going to sign Buehrle. Seems like he did everything he could to get to Fla. I guess it's CJ to LAA?
$58M. Hmm, my oldest boy is a lefty. I am getting that kid out i nthe back yard throwing it around rain or shine!
dfh21
Well, Buehrle to Marlins. Ugh. Please don't sign Wilson as a response. Let the Marlins take on another bad contract...
If you're going to trade Zim, let it be for McCuchen, at least.
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