tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post1297907044333075530..comments2024-02-15T05:42:18.307-05:00Comments on Nats Insider: The net effect of "Nat Gio"Mark Zuckermanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13525315258889435961noreply@blogger.comBlogger140125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-4727888840128976912011-12-27T11:30:54.090-05:002011-12-27T11:30:54.090-05:00Not only do I have no idea who you are, I have no ...Not only do I have no idea who you are, I have no idea what you're saying.Davehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07243007019646325480noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-59467289263586618232011-12-27T00:51:20.917-05:002011-12-27T00:51:20.917-05:00Every one commenting on Bryce Harper could be for...Every one commenting on Bryce Harper could be for not if he's not on the opening day roster.Harper earned a spot last year. Nats reason for holding him down to young.You need to listen to his interviews the Nats would loose him.then only fix trade Harper.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-18860261756994395242011-12-23T23:22:58.554-05:002011-12-23T23:22:58.554-05:00I think Cole and Peacock will both become #2 start...I think Cole and Peacock will both become #2 starters. I was excited<br />to watch both develop. But I'm cool with this trade because of the<br />window here. Neither of those guys are going to realize their<br />potential in the next two years and Gio already has. More, If the<br />Nationals teach him what the A's couldn't and he cuts down on the<br />walks, he will be even better.<br /><br />The other reason I'm down, as Zuck mentioned, is this window is wide.<br />We don't have to win the world series this year. Riz knows that even<br />if his wildest dreams come true, there is a ladder of success once you<br />are a post-season team. Besides Werth and LaRoche, none of these guys<br />have experience in the post-season, and that's a whole new ballgame.<br />We will have several years to climb that ladder.<br /><br /><br />*On an unrelated note, I am claiming the coining of the nickname Nat<br />Gio. I posted it in Mocospace Sports forum at 6:05pm the day of the<br />trade. If its shown to be posted by another beforehand, I'll gladly<br />give them their due. Maybe it sounds petty to claim such things, but<br />with this guy it might end up a worthwhile contribution within<br />NatsTown fan-dom.Seraphlaimhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12618421701428400535noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-45093753488708093672011-12-23T21:55:32.671-05:002011-12-23T21:55:32.671-05:00I think this is a great trade. You always want to...I think this is a great trade. You always want to get the best player in any deal and Gio is the best player in this deal. The other pitchers MAY turn out but Gonzalez HAS turned out and proven it over the last two years. I've seen him pitch, he is not a fluke. He has what is considered one (if not the) best 12-6 curveball for a lefty in the majors.<br /><br />The game is about the playoffs. The Nats now have a big three that can match up in the playoffs.<br /><br />I would like them to get a good CF. A short-term fix could be Coco who has gotten better and less injury prone but he is not a long term answer.<br /><br />The Nats dealt from stregnth. They gave up a lot, but more often than not these trades work better for the team getting the established player. The final evaluation of this trade is in the future; in the meantime it was an agressive and defensible trade to get the NAts through the playoffs, not just to the playoffs.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-58742073039339494542011-12-23T17:52:02.426-05:002011-12-23T17:52:02.426-05:00Germans? I mean, Marlins?
Sec 3, My Sofa said...
...Germans? I mean, Marlins?<br /><br />Sec 3, My Sofa said...<br /><br /> "Over? Did you say 'over'? NOTHING is over until WE say it's over! Was it over when the Marlins signed Albert Pujols??"<br /> December 23, 2011 4:41 PMnatsfan1anoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-60249767051544636472011-12-23T17:29:41.278-05:002011-12-23T17:29:41.278-05:00Somebody without a handle said, at 2:29:
"Th...Somebody without a handle said, at 2:29:<br /><br />"The Nats play the Marlins 18 times. When it is Gonzalez's turn to pitch he will have no trouble issuing a walk to Pujols every AB."<br /><br />Wow. Really? Have you not been paying any better attention the past two weeks than THAT?Davehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07243007019646325480noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-85475688743968479012011-12-23T16:59:53.615-05:002011-12-23T16:59:53.615-05:00"For anyone who thinks John Lannan will be po..."For anyone who thinks John Lannan will be pouring champagne on Gio's head when the Nats win a title, I wouldn't be so sure."<br /><br />My point wasn't so much a prediction about Lannan's future with the Nats as an observation about the nature of the unstated assumptions behind the whole "the Nats got fleeced" meme. <br /><br />People who say that assume a certainty about what will happen that is completely unwarranted. We don't know if Peacock and Cole will live up to their projections. Recall that some of the same people saying that Rizzo gave up too much told us that the Nats 2007 draft was stellar. They sang the praises of Detweiler, Smoker and McGeary. Oops!<br /><br />I'm not a Rizzo shill. (Really.) But when I read crap like "the trade for Gio shows that the Nats are desperate" I want to laugh and punch my monitor at the same time. Let's be clear: if peple saying things like that had a way of knowing which prospect will pan out and which won't that justified the certainty with which they made these kind of declarations they wouldn't be writing on the Internet -- they would be making big money consulting for MLB teams. <br /><br />It's like those people who hawk "get rich by buying real estate" or "how to beat the market" BS -- if they could do they wouldn't be selling their secrets on late-night television. <br /><br />End of rant.Robertohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09639740561105744622noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-28664979470538610202011-12-23T16:41:59.264-05:002011-12-23T16:41:59.264-05:00Uh, Pujols will be with the Angels, not the Marlin...<b>Uh, Pujols will be with the Angels, not the Marlins.</b><br /><br />"Over? Did you say 'over'? NOTHING is over until WE say it's over! Was it over when the Marlins signed Albert Pujols??"Soul Possession, PFB Sofahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08891662837668214475noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-83010037606272587762011-12-23T16:03:00.661-05:002011-12-23T16:03:00.661-05:00"As an NL pitcher he'll only be pitching ..."As an NL pitcher he'll only be pitching in one of those ballparks on a regular basis."<br /><br />The point I was trying to make was that when Gio pitches in *any* hitter-friendly ballpark, he tends to be a pretty bad pitcher. Once he gets to the NL and has to pitch in Philly, Cincy, Colorado, amongst others, then he may continue that trend. Just something to think about.erocks33noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-37402347574951399142011-12-23T15:34:43.838-05:002011-12-23T15:34:43.838-05:00Uh, Pujols will be with the Angels, not the Marlin...Uh, Pujols will be with the Angels, not the Marlins.natsfan1anoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-31090299675734548262011-12-23T14:29:41.902-05:002011-12-23T14:29:41.902-05:00I choose to look on the bright side of this trade....I choose to look on the bright side of this trade. The Nats play the Marlins 18 times. When it is Gonzalez's turn to pitch he will have no trouble issuing a walk to Pujols every AB. Rizzo is a genius.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-28318816022776784522011-12-23T13:25:17.378-05:002011-12-23T13:25:17.378-05:00There was some interesting blogs about my favorite...There was some interesting blogs about my favorite hitting instructor a couple days ago. I guess he has survived for another year. Sigh.Big Catnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-68004138977401536152011-12-23T13:21:43.344-05:002011-12-23T13:21:43.344-05:00Don't see how the Nats can deal Detwiler right...Don't see how the Nats can deal Detwiler right now. <br /><br />Wang has yet to confirm that he is all the way back from injury, and only has a one year deal. <br /><br />Lannan is a fringe #4/5 that is closing in on free agency. <br /><br />While the Nats have some good pitching prospects left in the organization, none of them even have ETAs yet, and the top ones (Solis and Purke) also have unresolved in jury concerns. <br /><br />Given those circumstances, Detwiller has to stay as either the #5 or a long reliever because when/if a starting pitcher or two goes down, the Nats options are really limited over the next couple of years. Also, given that it looks the focus of the rest of the off-season moves will be upgrading offense right now - it does not appear likely that more arms are on the way. <br /><br />Also, Detwiler has an elite arm. Not beyond the realm of possiblity for Detwiler to develop into a top of the line starter himself, which would make the next 4 years in DC really interesting for Nats fans and scary for everyone else in the NL East. <br /><br />So, when considering future roster tweaking in light of the Gio for the Nats most ready prospect arms, Detwiler is close to an untouchable right now IMO. <br /><br />PilchardAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-54229097170621589122011-12-23T13:18:36.883-05:002011-12-23T13:18:36.883-05:00new postnew postAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-37504672550747729812011-12-23T13:14:52.970-05:002011-12-23T13:14:52.970-05:00I'm trying to stay positive about this whole d...I'm trying to stay positive about this whole development, but somehow I feel like the Grinch stole Christmas.Joe Seamheadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17000259234420985114noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-28350739752049360192011-12-23T13:14:34.718-05:002011-12-23T13:14:34.718-05:00SteveM, disappointed in you. Today you seem okay w...SteveM, disappointed in you. Today you seem okay with Gio. In the previous days you laid out your trends on the different pitchers. Keith Law wrote today very similar thoughts to what you had earlier in the week on Gio. This trade doesn't sit well with me.Mark'dnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-11639086670261713162011-12-23T13:14:07.522-05:002011-12-23T13:14:07.522-05:00Anon at 12:44, its not the dimensions, its how a p...<i>Anon at 12:44, its not the dimensions, its how a park plays over the course of a year and all sports writers consider Oakland a pitcher friendly park.</i><br /><br />Hard stats not <i>sportswriter fluff</i> clearly indicate that Nats park fairly strongly favors left-handed hitters. Not home run wise but when it comes to doubles which is how most RBI are driven in. How do you offset a park that favors left-handed hitters? With left-handed pitchers.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-68936777459303769562011-12-23T13:11:01.586-05:002011-12-23T13:11:01.586-05:00This morning we wake up to see a depleted farm sys...<i>This morning we wake up to see a depleted farm system. I have very little confidence in Rizzo as a GM who can handle trades.</i><br /><br />Sigh, as Natsjack said the cupboard isn't exactly empty. What is now missing is depth particularly and acutely in AA/AAA. That's where you go when you have injuries. <br /><br />So, instead of having a farm system in the top 5, it probably drops to around 15. It could rise again depending on the performance of the most recent 2011 draftees and players they've moved to the states from the Dominican. <br /><br />You are still very, very deep in the left-handed starting pitching prospect department. Perhaps Alex Meyer and his 100mph fast ball replaces AJ Cole. Solis, Purke, and Rosenbaum all still there. Possibly the ***TOP TWO*** prospects (or at least positional) in all of baseball : Bryce Harper and Anthony Rendon STILL THERE. Both will likely be ranked better than Trout who isn't as good a CF fielding-wise as Borjous. Especially, if Trout isn't ready yet.<br /><br /><i>Prior to last year it was Kasten over-seeing the trades like Capps for Ramos. Every trade since then including proposed trades have not been good trades. Even the Hairston for Komatsu which was one of Rizzo's better trades was flawed as Komatsu was on a short fuse with pending Rule 5 and Rizzo should have sent him to AFL to see if he was worth protecting and now gone in Rule 5. Nyjer was given away. Marquis for Walters. Willingham for a reliever w/ no options. The rumored Greinke trade. Now this, essentially a 4 top prospect package for a #3 pitcher who will frustrate us almost as much as Henry Rodriguez.</i><br /><br />Clearly you're not watching or listening? To Johnson.<br /><br />Rizzo has done fine. Clearly his strength is the draft and most especially pitching. IF Rizzo values Gonzalez that highly there must be a good reason. He is still young at 26. That's Detwiler and Jordan Zimmermann. He can still be coached by former A's ace Steve McCatty on how to throw strikes and not nibble. He is just coming into his prime. <br /><br />This gives Johnson almost all that he wanted and needed, <i>(NO. HE DID NOT AND DOES NOT WANT A CF!!! Johnson put Werth in CF for a reason last year! </i>, he wanted, opined on, and now has a left-handed heavy rotation if he so desires. He has 3 power pitchers in Gonazlez, Detwiler, and Gorzelanny that can start. Plus the ubiquitous back of the rotation Lannan plus Rosenbaum in AA/AAA depth. <br /><br />Ancillary to that. NO, they are not going to trade the entire 2011 offense for prospects? Morse for prospects? What planet are you on? They are going to keep him in left field, Harper in right field, and Werth in CF for now. <br /><br />If Morse gets replaced its going to be for Anthony Rendon when he is ready. Rendon likely goes to 2nd though and then the whole nice problem of what to do with Desmond, Espinosa, Lombardozzi, Morse, Tyler Moore, etc. gets opened up. That's what's going to happen either next year or the year following. Did the Nats have these sorts of problems when Kasten and Bowden were running the show? Instead we got Lastings Milledge and Elijah Dukes? And Dunnkey ... and Guzman re-upped every time Bowden looked at him?<br /><br />Fools!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-528887347530710562011-12-23T13:04:10.688-05:002011-12-23T13:04:10.688-05:00Anon at 12:44, its not the dimensions, its how a p...Anon at 12:44, its not the dimensions, its how a park plays over the course of a year and all sports writers consider Oakland a pitcher friendly park.Mark'dnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-12246725339727426072011-12-23T13:02:39.486-05:002011-12-23T13:02:39.486-05:00I count myself as one in the crowd of "they g...I count myself as one in the crowd of "they gave up WHAT?" when I saw the news. However, I have thought a lot about this, and am now happy with the trade. That means I will renew my ST shares this year. (Oh, and we are looking for one more to make it 9 shares - behind home dugout, Sec 129 lower level - if anyone wants to chat about it.) <br /><br />Basically, Gio is a known quantity - after facing MLB hitters and scouts for 2 years, he arguably has gotten better, not worse, meaning he has no glaring weaknesses that other teams have figured out. We really can't say that about Peacock or Milone. I remember people were pretty high on Shairon Martis after his first few starts. He still hasn't made the show - last pitching in the bigs in 2009 with the Nats. <br /><br />There's a reason they are called "prospects" - because they are not READY yet. For all the promise they showed, Milone and Peacock had not convinced anyone they could break into our rotation, except for September call-up time. Think about that for a minute. <br /><br />They might make it, they might not. Gio HAS made it, and was the ace of the A's staff. There is a lot of value in that. <br /><br />We now have a good 1-2-3 and our 4-5 are very steady. The top of the rotation is locked up for 4 years. Sweet!<br /><br />And please remember, we may be able to trade Purke and Solis (or some other combo) to the A's for Peacock and Milone if those guys ever get good enough to demand a big payday. In effect, we can become Beane's second farm system. I'm OK with that. ;-)<br /><br />And really, I come up with "Gio's Gone Wild video" and no one say boo? Sigh. I thought that was pretty good.ehay2khttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16441654620820540390noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-87928002353494957232011-12-23T13:01:20.365-05:002011-12-23T13:01:20.365-05:00I hope your right MarkI hope your right MarkMicknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-85725985818225238502011-12-23T13:00:30.612-05:002011-12-23T13:00:30.612-05:00For anyone who thinks John Lannan will be pouring ...For anyone who thinks John Lannan will be pouring champagne on Gio's head when the Nats win a title, I wouldn't be so sure.<br /><br />Matt Purke has a major league deal. Before long Lannan will be shoveling his...um.... shaving cream pies somewhere else.<br /><br />Maybe someday Rizzo's to do list will read like this:<br /><br />1. Ship Lannan and Desmond in a deal for a CF.<br /><br />2. Do Snoopy dance.Drew8noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-15307437210497655632011-12-23T12:59:03.864-05:002011-12-23T12:59:03.864-05:00Rizzo hasn't disguised his desire to land a ve...Rizzo hasn't disguised his desire to land a veteran starting pitcher, someone who can be penciled in for 200 quality innings while also offering guidance to young aces Stephen Strasburg and Jordan Zimmermann. But there are plenty of other suitors for the three free agent starters who fit that description -- Mark Buehrle, C.J. Wilson and Roy Oswalt -- so it may still take some time for the pitching market to play itself out.<br /><br />Rizzo also has made it clear he's seeking a center fielder, someone who ideally could lead off and reach base at a high clip but above all else hold down a position that has been in flux since the day the Nationals arrived in town. An astounding 28 different men have played center field for the Nats over the last seven seasons. Knowing that, Rizzo would like the 29th man at that position to actually stick around for a while.<br /><br />Unfortunately, there aren't any real viable center field options in free agency. So Rizzo may have to get creative, whether in the form of an international signing such as Cuba's Yoenis Cespedes or a trade for an existing big leaguer such as Tampa Bay's B.J. Upton.<br /><br /><i>Going into the off season our focus was a leadoff batter and a CF period, we failed at both an instead make a Denny McClain type of deal over one pitcher.</i>from Mark's 12/4 post periodnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-23740518949924783652011-12-23T12:58:01.570-05:002011-12-23T12:58:01.570-05:00Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think it's ...Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think it's not uncommon for LH power starters to gain control later in their 20s, rather than sooner. Not saying he's Sandy Koufax, but there's a reasonable chance for considerable improvement to what looks like the weakest part of his game.Soul Possession, PFB Sofahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08891662837668214475noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-70521936333734226102011-12-23T12:57:22.164-05:002011-12-23T12:57:22.164-05:00Anonymous @ 12:44:
I agree that there's not a...Anonymous @ 12:44:<br /><br />I agree that there's not a huge difference in the Coliseum and Nats Park, but the Coliseum definitely plays bigger. For one, because of the huge foul territory down the lines, and for another, because of the Pacific marine layer off the Bay. The ball dies in the Coliseum, especially at night. Easy home runs turn into outs.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com