tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post5283048795669141780..comments2024-02-15T05:42:18.307-05:00Comments on Nats Insider: Nats get Gorzelanny for 3 prospectsMark Zuckermanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13525315258889435961noreply@blogger.comBlogger78125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-7188601150096489592011-01-18T13:13:13.791-05:002011-01-18T13:13:13.791-05:00I think Rizzo went with Gorzo to light a fire unde...I think Rizzo went with Gorzo to light a fire under Lannan and if John repeats 2010, he will be gone before 2012 ST!!!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-71044652113487422702011-01-18T12:38:29.246-05:002011-01-18T12:38:29.246-05:00Chris, I was strictly speaking of Nats prospects.
...Chris, I was strictly speaking of Nats prospects.<br />I've only seen 3 Nats prospects that had ML stuff in the Fall League. And if you've seen some of the arms masquerading as prospects, you'd know what I mean.<br /><br />..................................<br /><br />Phew, I feel better now :)Chrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05384823698218319042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-50644045793544281882011-01-18T09:51:24.398-05:002011-01-18T09:51:24.398-05:00When the Cubs got Gorz I said some of the same thi...When the Cubs got Gorz I said some of the same things you guys are saying. "He's only a few years removed from winning 14 games" I had hopes he could be a solid 4th starter. But he's going to be 29 this year and people are still talking about what he "could" be. Lifetime 4.68 ERA, 1.49 WHIP. If he wasn't lefthanded he wouldn't be a major league starter. That said, looking at your rotation this year, he can fill some innings for you and help win a few games.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13277446273230316952noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-76881912777982952992011-01-18T09:47:14.727-05:002011-01-18T09:47:14.727-05:00NatsJack, how do you compare Cole Kimball to Morr...NatsJack, how do you compare Cole Kimball to Morris?Big Catnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-36513615515080788442011-01-18T09:45:55.876-05:002011-01-18T09:45:55.876-05:00@NatsJack
I thought you would come around. I also...@NatsJack<br /><br />I thought you would come around. I also have favorite players that I would like to see succeed. I've heard good things about A.J. that he has a good head on his shoulders he has the tools and that he is learning how to pitch. <br /><br />Gorzelanny if healthy will defiantly added depth to the rotation and if you look at his breakdown by games last year you can see that at times he could be very effective. He did fade a little at the end but starting in the end of June he made 11 straight starts of 5 or more innings winning 4 in a row. Not great but better than most Nats pitchers on the staff currently. If Gorzelanny cuts down his walks he does have the potential of being a #3 pitcher.Tegwarhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05014621891563545863noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-2122596151123914922011-01-18T09:36:55.326-05:002011-01-18T09:36:55.326-05:00"If any of those guys end up being All-Stars,..."If any of those guys end up being All-Stars, then we can criticize Rizzo on the deal."<br /><br />Completely unfair and illegitimate. You can only evaluate a trade based on what you know now. Gorzelanny blows his knee out and Rizzo blew it? The Cubs develop Hicks into a quality MLB pitcher and Rizzo made a lousy trade?<br /><br />That's juvenile.<br />Based on what we know today, it's a reasonable deal for both sides. All personnel decisions have risk. All have a myriad of unknown potential outcomes. Regardless of how the careers work out of the 4 guys in this trade, this is an unspectacular, reasonable, ordinary baseball trade.Sunderlandnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-85427990084635709282011-01-18T09:28:23.951-05:002011-01-18T09:28:23.951-05:00So now Crasnick has us linked to Aaron Heilman. I...So now Crasnick has us linked to Aaron Heilman. It's looking more and more like a spring training casting call for the rotation, except this time (as opposed to JimBo's '07 circus*) with actual major leaguers, each trying for a good showing in '11.<br /><br />-Lannan trying to prove he's not the pitcher of the first half of 2010<br />-Detwiler trying to prove he's ready<br />-Wang trying to prove he's finally over his shoulder surgery and can get back to the top<br />-Gorzelanny trying to prove he's really the high-K, low HR-rate guy he's occasionally shown<br />-Livo proving he's still got gas in the tank<br />-Heilman trying to prove he can be a reliable starter<br /><br />One thing about quantity, I have much more confidence in one or two of these happening than in all of them.<br /><br />*whenever I think about that rotation audition in 2007, I always imagine the scene in Blazing Saddles where Taggert is recruiting bandits, and I chuckle. Then I weep.NatinBeantownnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-54990520342845774872011-01-18T09:17:40.399-05:002011-01-18T09:17:40.399-05:00If you read my 7:36 AM post, you'd have a bett...If you read my 7:36 AM post, you'd have a better understanding of all this.NatsJack in Floridanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-12796864818763660062011-01-18T09:03:17.035-05:002011-01-18T09:03:17.035-05:00Chris, you are exactly correct. We got a solid pit...Chris, you are exactly correct. We got a solid pitcher that can help us now! We need someone, anyone who we can actually count on to pitch game after game.<br /><br />To hear some here, we just traded Jack Morris, not A.J.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-57392938563027634372011-01-18T09:02:48.457-05:002011-01-18T09:02:48.457-05:00Chris, I was strictly speaking of Nats prospects.
...Chris, I was strictly speaking of Nats prospects.<br />I've only seen 3 Nats prospects that had ML stuff in the Fall League. And if you've seen some of the arms masquerading as prospects, you'd know what I mean.<br /><br />At least this Fall we had two guys in camp with ML stuff and 2 others with potential ML stuff. Prior to this Fall, Strasburg was the only guy in that category.NatsJack in Floridanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-10788650849277739522011-01-18T08:55:41.037-05:002011-01-18T08:55:41.037-05:00This is going to come back and haunt Nats Nation w...This is going to come back and haunt Nats Nation within 2 years. A.J. Morris was the second best pitching prospect I've seen in 3 years of watching Fall Instructional League. You don't have to be very baseball knowledgeable to know who was #1. <br /><br />............................................<br /><br />This is one of the most insane things I've ever read. Morris is a 24 year-old who has never pitched above A ball and projects as a middle reliever. Yet you just put him in the same class as the greatest pitching prospect of all time.Chrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05384823698218319042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-15690153445145741162011-01-18T08:51:40.329-05:002011-01-18T08:51:40.329-05:00We have to give up something in order to get somet...We have to give up something in order to get something in return. <br /><br />At the end of the day, we gave up 2 single-A pitchers and a position-blocked Bowden-era "toolsy" outfielder with questionable major league potential. If any of those guys end up being All-Stars, then we can criticize Rizzo on the deal.<br /><br />In return, we got an established major league starter, under team control through 2013. He is not the ace that Rizzo wanted, but it wasn't for lack of trying. Reports are Rizzo offered top dollar for De La Rosa and Vasquez, and offered the best package of prospects for Greinke, only to be turned down by all three. So Rizzo had to move down his wish list and go after Gorzelanny.<br /><br />If nothing else this solidifies the rotation for the start of the season. The rotation will be Livo, Zimmerman, Marquis, Lannan, and Gorzelanny. Wang, Maya, and Detwiler will have to prove their health/consistency at AAA. Later in the season, if we have more than 5 reliable major league starters, good for us and the trades will start to happen.<br /><br />Good move by Rizzo given the circumstances. As for the 40-man roster, I'd hope that Maxwell and Severino would be the first cuts, but I guess it could also be the Rule-5 guys and I would be ok with that. If Alex Cora makes the team, highly likely IMO, somebody else will have to go as well.Ballinonabudgetnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-67628314867903906912011-01-18T08:50:00.685-05:002011-01-18T08:50:00.685-05:00I guess it's safe to assume that Rizzo preferr...I guess it's safe to assume that Rizzo preferred Gorzelanny to both Jeff Francis and Chris Young.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-58792744560623604402011-01-18T08:44:18.010-05:002011-01-18T08:44:18.010-05:00Just got the word, Chris Young is going to the Met...Just got the word, Chris Young is going to the Mets.NatsJack in Floridanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-49563312522215048012011-01-18T07:36:02.369-05:002011-01-18T07:36:02.369-05:00OK... After a full nights rest I'm back from t...OK... After a full nights rest I'm back from the ledge. Let me just say that my apparent "man crush" on A.J. Morris comes from the three years of watching Fall Instructional League and I've only seen 3 guys with Major League stuff that made scouts either drool or shake their head. <br />One was obvious in Stephen but the other two were this past fall in A.J. Morris and Ryan Mattheus. Mattheus is 27 years old and coming off TJ but has a plus fastball and curve and a plus plus changeup with good command. <br />Morris is 24 years old and was an "old" 4th round pick out of Kansas State taken as a senior and 22 yo.<br />He's only had one full season in A ball and most of it was spent injured. He was targeted as a potential 2-3 starter but would advance quicker as a reliever. All scouts in Fall ball were all over him. He'll show up n the Cubs bull pen sometime this season<br />That said, I think Gorzelanny will prove to be a good pick up and force all other potential starters to step it up or move on.NatsJack in Floridanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-80166270085275735102011-01-18T07:16:11.460-05:002011-01-18T07:16:11.460-05:00Well Jeeves, I think Rizzo can get passed your bei...Well Jeeves, I think Rizzo can get passed your being pissed off!!Rabbitnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-39875386159495584912011-01-18T07:15:49.897-05:002011-01-18T07:15:49.897-05:00Anonymous, that Garza-Gorzelanny comparison is mis...Anonymous, that Garza-Gorzelanny comparison is misleading. Over the past 3 years, it paints a completely different picture:<br /><br />Garza: 3.86 ERA, 4.24 FIP, 7.9 WAR<br />Gorzelanny: 5.27 ERA, 4.81 FIP, 2.0 WAR<br />Stammen: 5.12 ERA, 4.34 FIP, 2.1 WARWillnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-31749233122147982292011-01-18T06:38:47.652-05:002011-01-18T06:38:47.652-05:00'incapable of fielding his position'--Burg...'incapable of fielding his position'--Burgess is an excellent fielder. Where do some of these ideas come from?<br />'getting rid of all Bowden picks'--Morris would be a Rizzo pick.Jeevesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-57016462671186487342011-01-17T23:24:51.034-05:002011-01-17T23:24:51.034-05:00A look from the other side, pretty similar assessm...A look from the other side, pretty similar assessment:<br />http://blogs.dailyherald.com/node/5088Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-27842016203729238852011-01-17T22:53:30.438-05:002011-01-17T22:53:30.438-05:00Eh, I was hoping for more than Gorze and Cora to m...Eh, I was hoping for more than Gorze and Cora to make a media splash in what will likely be the last two moves before ST. Given the fact that he is used to pitching for losing teams, he will fit into the culture of losing here!!<br /><br />For the guys we gave up, I think Morris had a huge upside and am sad to see him go. Burgess I wish they gave him a change to move to LF or 1B, he will be a starAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-80943979121863457192011-01-17T22:50:20.131-05:002011-01-17T22:50:20.131-05:00Have to remember that he accomplished what he has,...Have to remember that he accomplished what he has, playing for some very questionable teams. He might surprise.Slidell.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-25609059001908940802011-01-17T21:30:35.794-05:002011-01-17T21:30:35.794-05:00"He couldn't get Greinke or Garza done, s..."He couldn't get Greinke or Garza done, so another G-named SP would have to suffice."<br /><br />fangraphs appears to value Gorzelanny higher than Garza. And Gorzelanny is left handed after all. <br /><br />Gorzelanny FIP 3.92 WAR 1.82 Salary: $800,000 age: 28<br />Garza FIP 4.42 WAR 2.3 Salary: $3.35 million age: 27Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-49571357272611393732011-01-17T21:22:30.947-05:002011-01-17T21:22:30.947-05:00I'm not disappointed in this trade, but Rizzo ...<i>I'm not disappointed in this trade, but Rizzo has set the expectations so high that I'm bracing for something bigger.</i><br /><br />Bigger or NOT, he must still open two slots in the 40 man roster. One for La Roche and one for Gorzelanny.<br /><br />It seems certain that more moves are pending.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-19723590907865059262011-01-17T21:11:25.405-05:002011-01-17T21:11:25.405-05:00How blindly optimistic am I to think that this is ...How blindly optimistic am I to think that this is step 1 of a two-step move? We have too many batting-practice caliber starting pitchers, including 3 lefties. We have broadcast loudly our openness to trade one or two top prospects (Desmond/Espy/Storen). We have 2 too many players on the 40-man. Is there another shoe waiting to drop? <br /><br />I'm not disappointed in this trade, but Rizzo has set the expectations so high that I'm bracing for something bigger.Ernienoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3442809928829881676.post-46978658838274153642011-01-17T20:52:44.346-05:002011-01-17T20:52:44.346-05:00I think if Rizzo could get Gorzo cheaper, he'd...I think if Rizzo could get Gorzo cheaper, he'd have done it. He isn't throwing away prospects to just make a trade. I think he wants to make more moves so giving away ammo doesn't help his own cause. <br /><br />If this somewhat lateral move doesn't convince people that Rizzo isn't happy with what he has as a staff well …<br /><br />There are way too many "IFs" when discussing our current staff. He wants some stability, that is abundantly clear. Greinke/Lee wanted to go elsewhere, can't blame them or Rizzo. Each did what they had to do. To me, Rizzo has a solid plan and is working it, let's be patient and see where it gets us.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com